Case 1:17-cv-00687-WO-JLW Document 379 Filed 08/09/22 Page 1 of 182
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`IN THE UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT
`MIDDLE DISTRICT OF NORTH CAROLINA
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`)
`
`
`OPTOLUM, INC., )
`
` Greensboro, North Carolina )
` Plaintiff, November 3, 2021
` )
` vs. )
`
`)
`CREE, INC., )
`
` Case No. 1:17CV687 )
` Defendant. )
`_________________________________ )
`
`
`
`TRANSCRIPT OF TRIAL DAY 6
`BEFORE THE HONORABLE WILLIAM L. OSTEEN, JR.
`UNITED STATES DISTRICT JUDGE
`
`
`APPEARANCES:
`
`For the Plaintiff: ROBERT BROOKS
`LEAH R. MCCOY
`MCCARTER & ENGLISH, LLP
`265 FRANKLIN STREET
`BOSTON, MA 02110
`
`
`
`JACOB S. WHARTON
`WOMBLE BOND DISKINSON (US) LLP
`1 W. 4th STREET
`WINSTON-SALEM, NC 27101
`
`
`For the Defendant: BLANEY HARPER
`JONES DAY
`51 LOUISIANA AVE., N.W.
`WASHINGTON, DC 20001
`
`
`
`PETER D. SIDDOWAY
`SAGE PATENT GROUP
`4242 SIX FORKS ROAD, SUITE 1550
`RALEIGH, NC 27609
`
`Joseph B. Armstrong, FCRR
`Court Reporter:
` 324 W. Market, Room 101
`Greensboro, NC 27401
`
`
`
`Proceedings reported by stenotype reporter.
`Transcript produced by Computer-Aided Transcription.
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`November 3, 2021 - Trial Day 6
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`IN THE UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT
`MIDDLE DISTRICT OF NORTH CAROLINA
`
`)
`
`
`OPTOLUM, INC., )
`
` Greensboro, North Carolina )
` Plaintiff, November 3, 2021
` )
` vs. )
`
`)
`CREE, INC., )
`
` Case No. 1:17CV687 )
` Defendant. )
`_________________________________ )
`
`
`
`TRANSCRIPT OF TRIAL DAY 6
`BEFORE THE HONORABLE WILLIAM L. OSTEEN, JR.
`UNITED STATES DISTRICT JUDGE
`
`
`APPEARANCES:
`
`For the Plaintiff: ROBERT BROOKS
`LEAH R. MCCOY
`MCCARTER & ENGLISH, LLP
`265 FRANKLIN STREET
`BOSTON, MA 02110
`
`
`
`JACOB S. WHARTON
`WOMBLE BOND DISKINSON (US) LLP
`1 W. 4th STREET
`WINSTON-SALEM, NC 27101
`
`
`For the Defendant: BLANEY HARPER
`JONES DAY
`51 LOUISIANA AVE., N.W.
`WASHINGTON, DC 20001
`
`
`
`PETER D. SIDDOWAY
`SAGE PATENT GROUP
`4242 SIX FORKS ROAD, SUITE 1550
`RALEIGH, NC 27609
`
`Joseph B. Armstrong, FCRR
`Court Reporter:
` 324 W. Market, Room 101
`Greensboro, NC 27401
`
`
`
`Proceedings reported by stenotype reporter.
`Transcript produced by Computer-Aided Transcription.
`
`November 3, 2021 - Trial Day 6
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`Case 1:17-cv-00687-WO-JLW Document 379 Filed 08/09/22 Page 2 of 182
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`WITNESSES FOR THE DEFENDANT:
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`I N D E X
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`GERRY NEGLEY
`Direct Examination By Mr. Harper
`Cross-Examination By Mr. Brooks
`Redirect Examination By Mr. Harper
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`NEAL HUNTER
`Direct Examination By Mr. Harper
`Cross-Examination By Mr. Brooks
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`CURT PROGL
`Direct Examination By Mr. Harper
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`EXHIBITS: RCVD
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`DX 104
`DX 110
`DX 143
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`DX 145
`DX 146
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`DX 158
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`DX 177
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`DX 191
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`DX 206
`DX 211
`DX 218
`DX 220
`DX 222
`DX 227
`DX 228
`DX 237
`DX 243
`DX 247
`DX 251
`DX 255
`DX 258
`DX 261
`DX 293
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`CREEAZ_00379478-081
`CREEAZ_00401159-162
`Document: "LED Lighting Ready for General
`Illumination"
`CREEAZ_00100568-569
`CREEAZ_00090624-628
`CREEAZ_00112050-051
`CREEAZ_00407591
`CREEAZ_00386581
`CREEAZ_00270064
`CREEAZ_00355240-247
`Graph
`Summary for TWL Build
`CREEAZ_00380255
`CREEAZ_00277455-456
`CREEAZ_00380244
`CREEAZ_00090624-628
`CREEAZ_00112064-065
`CREEAZ_00409165
`CREEAZ_0040916
`CREEAZ_00269877-878
`CREEAZ_00270605
`CREEAZ_00401220-221
`CREEAZ_00401569-570
`CREEAZ_00381576-577
`CREEAZ_00401323-324
`CREEAZ_00401383-385
`CREEAZ_00384608-613
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`November 3, 2021 - Trial Day 6
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`Case 1:17-cv-00687-WO-JLW Document 379 Filed 08/09/22 Page 3 of 182
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`I N D E X
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`EXHIBITS: RCVD
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`DX 307
`DX 308
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`CREEAZ_00385026
`CREEAZ_00380197
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`November 3, 2021 - Trial Day 6
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`Case 1:17-cv-00687-WO-JLW Document 379 Filed 08/09/22 Page 4 of 182
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`09:34:49
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`09:35:40
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`P R O C E E D I N G S
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`(At 9:35 a.m., proceedings commence.)
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`THE COURT: So first up, a little housekeeping
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`matter. I'm speaking only of myself at this point. Those of
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`you who have kids know that your -- well, maybe you all are
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`different, but kids have a way of thinking their parents are
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`not the brightest bulbs in the shed. And there used to be a
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`saying, it's best to remain silent and let everybody think
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`you're stupid than to open your mouth and remove all doubt. I
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`opened my mouth yesterday and removed all doubt.
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`I called my daughter last night to make sure I told
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`you all correctly on the Jones Bird story, and she said, yeah,
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`that's correct, except it was Alston & Bird, not Jones Day. So
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`strike what I told you yesterday. We've already dealt with the
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`issue on Jones Day. That was the law clerk thing, we talked
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`about that, everybody's aware of it, and you had a chance to
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`address it, so my apologies for that.
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`And it'll probably take me a year to convince my
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`daughter that I actually know something about something, but
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`we'll see.
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`All right. Are we ready to proceed?
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`MR. HARPER: Ready, Your Honor.
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`THE COURT: Let's go for it. What are your plans on
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`the briefs? What time do you want --
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`MR. BROOKS: We'll be filing a brief by 10:00, Your
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`November 3, 2021 - Trial Day 6
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`Case 1:17-cv-00687-WO-JLW Document 379 Filed 08/09/22 Page 5 of 182
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`Honor.
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`THE COURT: All right. We'll look at it, and should
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`be able to look at it the latest over lunch, but we'll take a
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`look at it. All right.
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`Let's bring the jury in. Who's your first witness?
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`MR. HARPER: Gerry Negley.
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`(At 9:38 a.m., jurors arrive.)
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`THE COURT: All right. Mr. Harper, the case is now
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`with the Defendant. You may call your first witness.
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`MR. HARPER: Thank you, Your Honor. Cree now calls
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`Gerry Negley.
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`(Witness sworn by the clerk.)
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`THE COURT: All right. Yeah, if you get situated.
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`First, get comfortable in the chair. Then once you're
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`comfortable in the chair, that microphone will slide around,
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`and it'll also move up and down. Try to get it situated so
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`you're -- when you speak, you're speaking toward it.
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`THE WITNESS: Okay.
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`THE COURT: All right.
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`MR. HARPER: May I approach the witness, Your Honor?
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`THE COURT: You may.
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`MR. HARPER: Your Honor, with the permission of the
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`Court, I'd like to pre-introduce a series -- pre-admit a series
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`of exhibits that are going to be used with Mr. Negley that have
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`not been objected to by counsel of OptoLum.
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`November 3, 2021 - Trial Day 6
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`Case 1:17-cv-00687-WO-JLW Document 379 Filed 08/09/22 Page 6 of 182
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`Negley - Direct
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`THE COURT: All right.
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`MR. HARPER: So I will list them by number. The
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`first one is DX 143, DX 145, DX 146, DX 147, DX 163, DX 177,
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`DX 186, DX 191, DX 193, DX 206, DX 211, DX 218, DX 227, DX 228,
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`and DX 307. We ask that these exhibits be admitted.
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`THE COURT: No objection?
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`MR. BROOKS: No objection, Your Honor.
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`THE COURT: All right. Defendant Exhibits 143, 145,
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`146, 147, 163, 177, 186, 191, 193, 206, 211, 218, 227, 228, and
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`307 are admitted.
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`You may proceed.
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`MR. HARPER: Thank you, Your Honor.
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`GERRY NEGLEY,
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`DEFENDANT'S WITNESS, SWORN AT 9:40 a.m.
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`DIRECT EXAMINATION
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`BY MR. HARPER:
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`Q
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`A
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`Q
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`A
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`Q
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`A
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`Mr. Negley, please introduce yourself to the jury.
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`My name is Gerald Harris Negley. I go by Gerry.
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`Where do you live?
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`I live in Chapel Hill, North Carolina.
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`And are you currently employed?
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`I am not; I retired.
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`How long have you been retired?
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`I retired from Cree in 2014 and helped out another startup
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`for another year, but haven't done anything since 2015.
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`November 3, 2021 - Trial Day 6
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`Case 1:17-cv-00687-WO-JLW Document 379 Filed 08/09/22 Page 7 of 182
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`Negley - Direct
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`Q
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`When were you hired at Cree?
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`I started at Cree February 2, 1993.
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`And why do you remember that day?
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`I was living in Florida at the time, and drove up; and I
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`left on my youngest son's birthday, drove up to a new job.
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`Q
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`What was your job when you were hired at Cree?
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`I was hired to be their -- to manage their wafer fab.
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`That's where we would take a wafer and make LEDs on it.
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`What was your job when you retired from Cree?
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`I was Chief Technology Officer for the lighting group.
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`Are you familiar with the Cree LED lightbulb?
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`I'm very familiar with the lightbulb.
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`How are you familiar with the Cree lightbulb?
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`It was my project. It was my baby.
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`In front of you, I have a package with one of the bulbs in
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`it. Can you take it out?
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`Q
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`A
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`Yep.
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`Can you show the jury? What is that?
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`This is the Cree -- let's see, that's -- yep, 60-watt
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`lightbulb. And we, at the time, wanted to make something that
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`generally looked like a lightbulb so it would be easily
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`accepted by the public.
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`Q
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`How does this Cree LED bulb work?
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`Well, assembled, it's pretty easy. You screw it into the
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`socket, right? Flip the switch, it comes on.
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`November 3, 2021 - Trial Day 6
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`Case 1:17-cv-00687-WO-JLW Document 379 Filed 08/09/22 Page 8 of 182
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`Negley - Direct
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`If we take it apart a little bit, take off -- you've
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`got the glass globe. What we did to mimic a lightbulb, we knew
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`that we wanted it to look like a filament, so we raised the
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`LEDs up off the -- I'd call it the platform, so to speak. So
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`we have the LEDs pointing outwards to mimic a filament, and
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`this was later termed "the light tower," and that's attached to
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`a heat sink. It's one piece.
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`And underneath this heat sink is a power supply,
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`because unlike a lightbulb that runs off 120 volts, we have to
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`do some power conversion. Then, of course, at the bottom is an
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`Edison socket so we can screw it into a socket.
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`Q
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`What is the function of the globe?
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`The globe has a -- there's a couple functions here, one of
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`which is protection to a human. The globe actually has
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`silicone on it, so if you drop it, it will not create a hole or
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`a path where you could poke your finger through and get
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`shocked. It also helps with the light distribution.
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`Q
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`Does the Cree LED bulb generate heat?
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`Not compared to an incandescent bulb, but there is some
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`heat associated with it. The heat sink probably gets warm to
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`the touch.
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`Q
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`How is the heat generated?
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`Nothing is 100 percent efficient, and for the -- what goes
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`into the LEDs in terms of power, if it's not converted to
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`light, it's converted to heat.
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`November 3, 2021 - Trial Day 6
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`Case 1:17-cv-00687-WO-JLW Document 379 Filed 08/09/22 Page 9 of 182
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`Negley - Direct
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`Q
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`Does the heat that is generated from the LEDs inside the
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`bulb stay inside the bulb?
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`A
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`No. We have to get it from the inside of the bulb to the
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`outside of the bulb. One of the demises of an LED is heat.
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`Two things happen: One, they get dimmer; and, two, they lose
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`lifetime, so it's very imperative to get the heat out of the
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`bulb.
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`Q
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`And how is the heat moved from the LEDs inside the bulb to
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`outside of the bulb?
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`A
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`Yeah. It's our thermal path. LEDs are here. It conducts
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`down this metal tower, which is cast with the fins. So with a
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`-- when you have a shell over top, right, the heat travels
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`down, and this ring will get hot in the room. Ambient air in
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`the room, airflow, will help then dissipate that heat to the
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`room.
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`Q
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`Is the heat sink designed to conduct heat from the LEDs
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`into the inside of the tower?
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`18
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`19
`
`20
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`A
`
`Q
`
`A
`
`Not whatsoever.
`
`Why?
`
`We had done some previous designs, and what we found was
`
`21
`
`that the air or whatever gas you have in there seems to be
`
`22
`
`quite stagnant.
`
`23
`
`Q
`
`Does the air inside of the heat sink tower in the Cree
`
`24
`
`bulb move through the tower from the bottom to the top, like in
`
`25
`
`a chimney?
`
`09:46:39
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`09:46:43
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`09:46:45
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`November 3, 2021 - Trial Day 6
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`Case 1:17-cv-00687-WO-JLW Document 379 Filed 08/09/22 Page 10 of 182
`
`Negley - Direct
`
` 10
`
` 1
`
` 2
`
` 3
`
`A
`
`Q
`
`A
`
`I do not believe so.
`
`Why not?
`
`It's a stagnant environment. The heat is on the outside
`
` 4
`
`of the tower, and it just -- it, in some regards, you know, if
`
` 5
`
`I were to take the base of this heat sink off and had the globe
`
` 6
`
`in it, if I tried to blow on that, it'd be like blowing on a
`
` 7
`
`straw with my finger at the end. There's -- there's just -- I
`
` 8
`
`don't believe there's any flow inside there.
`
` 9
`
`10
`
`Q
`
`A
`
`Is there anything inside the tower?
`
`There is a -- I don't know if I can pull it out. Probably
`
`11
`
`not. Yeah. There is an electrical connector that slides down
`
`12
`
`and makes the connection, and later we -- on our second rev, we
`
`13
`
`actually had to put a cap on the top because thermal cycling,
`
`14
`
`this board would actually move up a little bit.
`
`15
`
`Q
`
`And how does that connector inside the tower affect any
`
`16
`
`airflow that would be inside the tower?
`
`17
`
`A
`
`Anytime you put an obstruction in there, I've got to
`
`18
`
`believe it would inhibit any flow, if there was any.
`
`19
`
`20
`
`Q
`
`A
`
`How do you know the bulb works the way you explained it?
`
`We went through -- this was our third design, and from our
`
`21
`
`second design, we learned a lot, and it just told me that the
`
`22
`
`heat transfer's all by conduction and not by convection.
`
`23
`
`Q
`
`What was the structure of the second design that you're
`
`24
`
`referring to?
`
`25
`
`A
`
`The second design that we did -- I had names for all my
`
`09:48:18
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`09:48:20
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`09:48:20
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`09:50:07
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`09:50:09
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`09:50:12
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`November 3, 2021 - Trial Day 6
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`
`
`Case 1:17-cv-00687-WO-JLW Document 379 Filed 08/09/22 Page 11 of 182
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`09:50:15
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`09:50:21
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`09:51:50
`
`Negley - Direct
`
` 11
`
` 1
`
`products, and it was called PHIL. There was no external heat
`
` 2
`
`sink to it. The LEDs were, again, up in a filament-type
`
` 3
`
`structure, and we had filled the bulb with helium.
`
` 4
`
`Helium has the highest thermal conductivity -- or one
`
` 5
`
`of the highest thermal conductivities -- helium and hydrogen
`
` 6
`
`are the two -- and we put helium in there, and the idea was to
`
` 7
`
`have the helium, because of the high thermal conductivity,
`
` 8
`
`transfer the heat from LEDs, through the gas, to the outer
`
` 9
`
`shell, to the environment.
`
`10
`
`And that worked fine for a 40-watt bulb design. We
`
`11
`
`had issues with the 60-watt bulb design, degradation issues.
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`Q
`
`A
`
`Q
`
`A
`
`Q
`
`A
`
`Q
`
`A
`
`Q
`
`A
`
`And when you say you "had issues," what do you mean?
`
`It degraded. It degraded quickly.
`
`So --
`
`Degraded in terms of light output; got dimmer.
`
`So let me take you to Exhibit 191 in your binder.
`
`Yes.
`
`Do you have it?
`
`Yes, I do.
`
`What is this document?
`
`This is -- the bottom part of the graph shows the optical
`
`22
`
`degradation in terms of percentage, and we're talking about a
`
`23
`
`very short period of time, hours, 24 hours, it started to
`
`24
`
`degrade. And it showed that it could be a potential
`
`25
`
`contaminant in PHIL that was causing this. That was the
`
`November 3, 2021 - Trial Day 6
`
`
`
`Case 1:17-cv-00687-WO-JLW Document 379 Filed 08/09/22 Page 12 of 182
`
`Negley - Direct
`
` 12
`
` 1
`
`hypothesis at the time.
`
` 2
`
` 3
`
`Q
`
`A
`
`What is the photograph on the right?
`
`The top photograph or the bottom photograph? One is of --
`
` 4
`
`completely of the bulb, and the other is of the filament tower.
`
` 5
`
` 6
`
`Q
`
`A
`
`And how is the filament tower constructed?
`
`I'm sorry. In this case, it's a very similar board that
`
` 7
`
`is bent circular, has 20 LEDs, clusters of two going around,
`
` 8
`
`and that's bonded to a metal heat sink -- metal core board that
`
` 9
`
`acts as a heat sink, and that's attached to a glass filament
`
`10
`
`structure.
`
`11
`
`Q
`
`Now, describe what the location of that filament was with
`
`12
`
`respect to the glass globe that's in the top picture.
`
`13
`
`A
`
`It's -- that filament tower is about midpoint or a little
`
`14
`
`bit higher in the glass globe. Again, it was put at the
`
`15
`
`position to mimic an incandescent bulb.
`
`16
`
`Q
`
`Why did you put the filament tower in the place that you
`
`17
`
`did?
`
`18
`
`A
`
`Mimicking an incandescent bulb to get the light
`
`19
`
`distribution that we were looking for.
`
`20
`
`21
`
`Q
`
`A
`
`Now, what did you learn from testing of the PHIL bulb?
`
`We learned -- because the 40-watt product or design, I'll
`
`22
`
`say, worked -- did not optically degrade and the 60-watt did --
`
`23
`
`we -- we learned -- one thing we learned was it was stagnant in
`
`24
`
`there. And the way we learned this was trying to get the
`
`25
`
`60-watt bulb to work, I put a fan inside to move the gas
`
`09:51:55
`
`09:51:57
`
`09:52:01
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`09:52:04
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`09:52:09
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`09:52:23
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`09:52:29
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`09:52:35
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`09:52:39
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`09:52:41
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`09:52:47
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`09:52:53
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`09:53:00
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`09:53:05
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`09:53:07
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`09:53:10
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`09:53:14
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`09:53:18
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`09:53:20
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`09:53:27
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`09:53:39
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`09:53:47
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`09:53:50
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`November 3, 2021 - Trial Day 6
`
`
`
`Case 1:17-cv-00687-WO-JLW Document 379 Filed 08/09/22 Page 13 of 182
`
`Negley - Direct
`
` 13
`
` 1
`
`around, the helium, and that was a huge benefit.
`
` 2
`
`But you get a buzz from the fan, fans are expensive,
`
` 3
`
`fans have lifetime issues. And we learned a lot from it, but
`
` 4
`
`it wasn't going to be the product.
`
` 5
`
` 6
`
`Q
`
`A
`
`So was a fan an actual option?
`
`It -- we had a price point we were looking for, and the
`
` 7
`
`fan was costly.
`
` 8
`
`Q
`
`Had you worked on other bulb structures prior to the PHIL
`
` 9
`
`bulb?
`
`10
`
`A
`
`Yeah. We had -- again, I had names for all of mine. The
`
`11
`
`first one was called BOB.
`
`12
`
`13
`
`Q
`
`A
`
`And what did BOB refer to?
`
`BOB was referred to baby oil bulb. Literally had baby oil
`
`14
`
`inside as the liquid to transfer the heat from the LEDs, again,
`
`15
`
`to the outer surface of the bulb and to the room.
`
`16
`
`17
`
`Q
`
`A
`
`Did that work?
`
`Yeah, I think it had potential, but there was -- there was
`
`18
`
`some concerns with it. Biggest one was marketing concern, you
`
`19
`
`know, somebody calls up, my bulb leaked on to my Persian rug,
`
`20
`
`you know, leaking bulbs, drop it, it had to pass a drop test.
`
`21
`
`We -- we abandoned it pretty quickly. In terms of
`
`22
`
`functionality, it would work.
`
`23
`
`Q
`
`Had you done research projects on bulb structures before
`
`24
`
`you started with BOB?
`
`25
`
`A
`
`We, at Cree, we did some -- we did some work on bulbs. We
`
`09:53:54
`
`09:53:57
`
`09:54:04
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`09:54:07
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`09:54:12
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`09:54:27
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`09:54:31
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`09:54:37
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`09:54:38
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`09:54:42
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`09:54:45
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`09:54:46
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`09:54:54
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`09:54:59
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`09:55:02
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`09:55:07
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`09:55:10
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`09:55:14
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`09:55:20
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`09:55:26
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`09:55:32
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`09:55:37
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`09:55:41
`
`November 3, 2021 - Trial Day 6
`
`
`
`Case 1:17-cv-00687-WO-JLW Document 379 Filed 08/09/22 Page 14 of 182
`
`Negley - Direct
`
` 14
`
` 1
`
`did some technical demonstrations for the most part.
`
` 2
`
`Q
`
`Do you recall a technical demonstration referred to as
`
` 3
`
`TWL?
`
` 4
`
`A
`
`Yes. TWL was the true white lamp. True white was a color
`
` 5
`
`combination that I had invented back in 2005 -- 2006, and then
`
` 6
`
`we -- that was primarily used in the light fixtures we were
`
` 7
`
`making at the time. And then we looked at that technology for
`
` 8
`
`a bulb because it's highly efficient, and --
`
` 9
`
`Q
`
`So I show you -- if I can get you to turn to
`
`10
`
`Exhibit DX 193. Do you have it?
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`A
`
`Q
`
`A
`
`Q
`
`A
`
`Yes, I do.
`
`What is this document?
`
`It's the summary for the TWL build.
`
`And what is the basic construction of the TWL build?
`
`Of course, it has the screw to go into the Edison socket
`
`16
`
`at the bottom. Then there is a power supply buried inside of a
`
`17
`
`heat sink, so it really -- from the outside, you just see the
`
`18
`
`heat sink.
`
`19
`
`And then on top of that heat sink, it's flat. And
`
`20
`
`the LEDs are on a metal core board on that flat surface, so the
`
`21
`
`heat from the LEDs goes through the metal core board out to
`
`22
`
`the -- out -- down to the heat sink, and out to the
`
`23
`
`environment. And then, of course, there's a glass globe on the
`
`24
`
`top of it.
`
`25
`
`Q
`
`So are -- the LEDs that are shown here, are they inside or
`
`09:55:47
`
`09:55:53
`
`09:55:57
`
`09:55:58
`
`09:56:06
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`09:56:19
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`09:56:23
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`09:56:30
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`09:56:33
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`09:56:36
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`09:56:48
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`09:56:49
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`09:56:53
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`09:56:56
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`09:57:01
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`09:57:08
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`09:57:12
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`09:57:15
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`09:57:15
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`09:57:19
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`09:57:23
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`09:57:28
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`09:57:31
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`09:57:35
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`09:57:35
`
`November 3, 2021 - Trial Day 6
`
`
`
`Case 1:17-cv-00687-WO-JLW Document 379 Filed 08/09/22 Page 15 of 182
`
`Negley - Direct
`
` 1
`
`outside the globe?
`
` 15
`
` 2
`
` 3
`
` 4
`
`A
`
`Q
`
`A
`
`The LEDs are inside the globe.
`
`And what is the heat path from the LEDs?
`
`The heat path is the LEDs are mounted to that metal core
`
` 5
`
`board, so it goes from the LED component to the metal core
`
` 6
`
`board. The metal core board is attached to the heat sink, so
`
` 7
`
`then the heat goes to the heat sink, and then is radiated on
`
` 8
`
`the fins to the environment.
`
` 9
`
`Q
`
`So in your work with Cree bulbs and any other structures,
`
`10
`
`what is the heat path removal structure that you use?
`
`11
`
`A
`
`All of our designs, starting from the very first product I
`
`12
`
`made, which was a 6-inch downlight, all of our designs were you
`
`13
`
`need to get the heat to the room, okay?
`
`14
`
`So for -- so this design is no different than the
`
`15
`
`bulb design. It's no different than the very first 6-inch
`
`16
`
`downlight that I made. Heat has to travel some path down to an
`
`17
`
`exposure to the room.
`
`18
`
`Q
`
`So let's back up a little bit. You've been at -- you were
`
`19
`
`at Cree by the time that -- well, let me say it this way:
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`A
`
`Q
`
`When did you start at Cree?
`
`1993.
`
`And by the time you started -- by the time you retired,
`
`23
`
`you had a -- did you have patents on your work?
`
`24
`
`A
`
`Yes. I have -- right now I'm inventor or co-inventor of
`
`25
`
`254 patents.
`
`09:57:41
`
`09:57:42
`
`09:57:45
`
`09:57:50
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`09:57:55
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`09:57:58
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`09:58:01
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`09:58:06
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`09:58:08
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`09:58:15
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`09:58:22
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`09:58:27
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`09:58:32
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`09:58:34
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`09:58:42
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`09:58:45
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`09:58:51
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`09:58:53
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`09:59:00
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`09:59:04
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`09:59:06
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`09:59:09
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`09:59:12
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`09:59:14
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`09:59:21
`
`November 3, 2021 - Trial Day 6
`
`
`
`Case 1:17-cv-00687-WO-JLW Document 379 Filed 08/09/22 Page 16 of 182
`
`Negley - Direct
`
` 16
`
` 1
`
` 2
`
`Q
`
`A
`
`And what do those relate to generally?
`
`All but three of them are related to either chip structure
`
` 3
`
`or design, fabrication, or packaging design and fabrication, or
`
` 4
`
`lighting devices.
`
` 5
`
` 6
`
`Q
`
`A
`
`Where did you go to college?
`
`Undergraduate school, I went to a small school called
`
` 7
`
`Widener College in Chester, Pennsylvania, now called Widener
`
` 8
`
`University. And then, graduate school, I went to the
`
` 9
`
`University of Delaware, physics department, and specialty in
`
`10
`
`luminescence.
`
`11
`
`12
`
`Q
`
`A
`
`What was your first job after you got out of school?
`
`First job out of school, I decided not to work on my Ph.D.
`
`13
`
`My advisor died two days before my master's defense, so there's
`
`14
`
`a startup three blocks away, and I moved from the physics
`
`15
`
`department office to a little startup of seven people. Three
`
`16
`
`blocks, still on the University of Delaware campus, it was a
`
`17
`
`spin-off of the University of Delaware. It was called Astro
`
`18
`
`Power.
`
`19
`
`20
`
`Q
`
`A
`
`And what did you do at Astro Power?
`
`Astro Power was developing photovoltaics, solar cells, and
`
`21
`
`I actually started up their compound semiconductor research
`
`22
`
`group.
`
`23
`
`24
`
`Q
`
`A
`
`And what did you do after you left Astro Power?
`
`The first time I left Astro Power, I went off to do my own
`
`25
`
`startup. I had some great ideas, and it looked pretty easy,
`
`09:59:22
`
`09:59:26
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`09:59:33
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`09:59:40
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`09:59:42
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`09:59:43
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`09:59:48
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`09:59:52
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`09:59:55
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`10:00:03
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`10:00:03
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`10:00:06
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`10:00:16
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`10:00:19
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`10:00:24
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`10:00:30
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`10:00:33
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`10:00:37
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`10:00:37
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`10:00:40
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`10:00:46
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`10:00:49
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`10:00:49
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`10:00:56
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`10:01:01
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`November 3, 2021 - Trial Day 6
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`
`
`Case 1:17-cv-00687-WO-JLW Document 379 Filed 08/09/22 Page 17 of 182
`
`Negley - Direct
`
` 17
`
` 1
`
`and it turned out to be a lot harder than I thought. So after
`
` 2
`
`a year, I abandoned my dreams at that point and went back to
`
` 3
`
`Astro Power to help out with some programs that I started with.
`
` 4
`
` 5
`
`Q
`
`A
`
`And how long did that last?
`
`Well, unfortunately, after being back for about four
`
` 6
`
`weeks, I realized why I left in the first place, but I stayed
`
` 7
`
`there for about another year or so, and then I got a call from
`
` 8
`
`a buddy of mine and took a job down in Florida.
`
` 9
`
`10
`
`Q
`
`A
`
`And what was the job in Florida?
`
`It was quite a change for me. I'd always done R&D, make
`
`11
`
`one device work, you're doing great. I went down to help out a
`
`12
`
`product line that was 23 years old, and they made anti-theft
`
`13
`
`tags. You know, you walk through a gate, and if you didn't pay
`
`14
`
`for it, bells and whistles go off, and they were running a
`
`15
`
`60 percent yield, 23-year product line, and my job was to fix
`
`16
`
`it.
`
`17
`
`My boss was a buddy of mine from graduate school. So
`
`18
`
`there's a little diode in the thing -- in the tag, as we called
`
`19
`
`it, and only four people worked in their wafer fab, and all the
`
`20
`
`other engineers thought that the problem had to be the diode,
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`so that's why I was hired.
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`22
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`23
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`Q
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`A
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`And did you fix it?
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`The diode wasn't the problem. I got some stuff. There's
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`24
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`16,000 diodes on a wafer, and the concern was that they would
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`only -- the guy in the wafer fab would just randomly test 16,
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`November 3, 2021 - Trial Day 6
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`Case 1:17-cv-00687-WO-JLW Document 379 Filed 08/09/22 Page 18 of 182
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`Negley - Direct
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` 18
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` 1
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`and if 16 were good on a wafer, he would say that wafer was
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`good, and he was absolutely right.
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`Wafers were running about 98 percent yield when I had
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`them probed offsite, you know, for testing, and -- but it's
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`just a matter of statistics. All 16 randomly, they're good;
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`out of 16,000, you've got a good wafer; if one's bad, you got
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`junk.
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` 8
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` 9
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`Q
`
`A
`
`So after this job, what was your next job?
`
`I was there for -- I was at -- the company was called
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`10
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`Sensormatic. I was there for almost two years, and we had
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`11
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`gotten the yield up to 95 percent. And I sent a resume to
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`12
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`Cree, and heard back from them pretty quickly and ended up
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`13
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`going up there for employment.
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`14
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`15
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`Q
`
`A
`
`Why did you choose Cree?
`
`Well, it was a smaller company. I like -- I feel -- felt
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`16
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`more comfortable at smaller companies, and they were doing some
`
`17
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`exciting stuff. They were making a blue LED, and it was -- at
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`18
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`that time, the technology was it was a very dim blue LED, but
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`19
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`it was still blue.
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`20
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`And with my background in R&D, and I figured with
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`21
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`my -- the fact that they were trying to ramp up manufacturing,
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`22
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`with my new manufacturing experience, it'd be a good match, and
`
`23
`
`so off I came to North Carolina.
`
`24
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`25
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`Q
`
`A
`
`And when you joined, what was your position at Cree?
`
`When I started out at Cree, I was their wafer fabrication
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`10:02:52
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`November 3, 2021 - Trial Day 6
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`Case 1:17-cv-00687-WO-JLW Document 379 Filed 08/09/22 Page 19 of 182
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`Negley - Direct
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` 19
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` 1
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`manager. My job was to take a wafer and create the LED --
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` 2
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`individual LED structures on it.
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` 3
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` 4
`
`Q
`
`A
`
`And who did you report to at Cree?
`
`When I first got there, technically, it would've been the
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` 5
`
`operations manager. His name was Jim Lumberg. I interacted
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` 6
`
`more with one of the cofounders, John Edmond, because he had
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` 7
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`been burdened with trying to do everything, including running
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` 8
`
`the fab, so he was sort of my sounding board.
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` 9
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`10
`
`Q
`
`A
`
`And did your role expand while you were at Cree?
`
`Yeah -- yes, quite a bit. So my job was to make the LEDs
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`11
`
`on a wafer, and then I would send them to our test and package
`
`12
`
`area. And, very quickly, they gave me the responsibility for
`
`13
`
`the test and package area because they figured I might as well
`
`14
`
`be responsible for what I made, and it gave me more -- more or
`
`15
`
`quicker feedback to the fab in case we did have a problem. So
`
`16
`
`I sort of got -- took over the back end of LED manufacturing.
`
`17
`
`18
`
`Q
`
`A
`
`And how long did you do that?
`
`Well, at some point, I took over all responsibility for
`
`19
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`LED manufacturing, the epitaxial growth through the test and
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`20
`
`package area. I did -- did that up until -- I guess it was
`
`21
`
`really 2001.
`
`22
`
`23
`
`Q
`
`A
`
`And what happened at that time?
`
`We had -- it was crazy. We had a big order from Osram.
`
`24
`
`We had to shift distributions. We had to quadruple
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`25
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`manufacturing. I mean, we worked really hard for a period of
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`November 3, 2021 - Trial Day 6
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`Case 1:17-cv-00687-WO-JLW Document 379 Filed 08/09/22 Page 20 of 182
`
`Negley - Direct
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` 20
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` 1
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`time, and at one point, between engineers and all the direct
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` 2
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`labor, I had about 600 people reporting to me, not what a
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` 3
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`physicist really wants to do. I like technology. People are
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` 4
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`great. I like technology, and we were running a 7-by-24-hour
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` 5
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`operation, and I always made sure I would see each shift every
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` 6
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`day, and I got tired.
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` 7
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`So Cree -- I helped Cree create a sabbatical program,
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` 8
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`and I took seven months off work, and I still got benefits, got
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` 9
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`a reduced salary, and, of course, the deal was if they had an
`
`10
`
`issue, I had to come back and help them out.
`
`11
`
`Q
`
`And when you came back, what were you -- what was the job
`
`12
`
`then?
`
`13
`
`A
`
`Well, one of the deals of the sabbatical was I was
`
`14
`
`guaranteed a job when I came back, but I -- before I left, I
`
`15
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`had to backfill my own position. So I was guaranteed a job,
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`16
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`wouldn't know what it was.
`
`17
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`And I came back to Cree and ultimately ended up
`
`18
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`setting up their power LED production. We had to design the
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`19
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`product and then make it. And it was something that Cree said
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`20
`
`they would never do. They were a chip supplier. Let their
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`21
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`customers do their job, packaging. I mean, that's their
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`22
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`business.
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`23
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`But we had come out with what we called the power
`
`24
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`chip. It was a larger chip. We were trying -- there's one
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`25
`
`other competitor out there that had already come out with one,
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`10:06:31
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`10:08:18
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`November 3, 2021 - Trial Day 6
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`
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`Case 1:17-cv-00687-WO-JLW Document 379 Filed 08/09/22 Page 21 of 182
`
`Negley - Direct
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` 21
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` 1
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`and we gave it to all of our customers, and none of them could
`
` 2
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`figure out how to package it.
`
` 3
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`And myself and anot
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