throbber
Roberto Tamassia
`
`Page 1
`
` UNITED STATES PATENT AND TRADEMARK OFFICE
` _______________
` BEFORE THE PATENT TRIAL AND APPEAL BOARD
` _______________
`
` APPLE INC.
` Petitioner
` v.
` VIRNETX INC. AND APPLICATION
` INTERNATIONAL CORPORATION
` Patent Owner
` _______________
`
` Case No. IPR2015-00866
` Case No. IPR2015-00867
` Case No. IPR2015-00868
` Case No. IPR2015-00869
` Case No. IPR2015-00870
` Case No. IPR2015-00871
` Patent No. 8,458,341
` Patent No. 8,516,131
` Patent No. 8,560,705
` _______________
`
` DEPOSITION OF ROBERTO TAMASSIA
` Washington, D.C.
` Thursday, January 14, 2016
`
`Reported by: John L. Harmonson, RPR
`Job No. 99553
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 800-702-9580
`
`1
`2
`3
`
`45
`
`6
`7
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`23
`24
`25
`
`VIRNETX EXHIBIT 2022
`Apple v. VirnetX
`Trial IPR2015-00866
`
`Page 1 of 80
`
`

`
`Roberto Tamassia
`
`Page 2
`
` January 14, 2016
` 9:09 a.m.
`
` Deposition of ROBERTO TAMASSIA, held at the
`offices of Sidley Austin, LLP, 1501 K Street,
`N.W., Washington, D.C., before John L. Harmonson,
`a Registered Professional Reporter and Notary
`Public of the District of Columbia, who
`officiated in administering the oath to the
`witness.
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 800-702-9580
`
`1 2 3 4 5
`
`6
`
`7 8 9
`
`10
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`23
`24
`25
`
`Page 2 of 80
`
`

`
`Roberto Tamassia
`
`Page 3
`
` A P P E A R A N C E S
`
`On Behalf of Petitioner, Apple Inc.:
` SIDLEY AUSTIN
` 1501 K Street, N.W.
` Washington, D.C. 20005
` BY: THOMAS BROUGHAN III, ESQ.
` SCOTT BORDER, ESQ.
`
`On Behalf of Patent Owner, VirnetX Inc.:
` PAUL HASTINGS
` 875 15th Street, N.W.
` Washington, D.C. 20005
` BY: JOSEPH PALYS, ESQ.
` DANIEL ZEILBERGER, ESQ.
` CHETAN BANSAL, ESQ.
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 800-702-9580
`
`1
`
`2 3
`
`4
`5
`6
`7
`8
`9
`10
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`23
`24
`25
`
`Page 3 of 80
`
`

`
`Roberto Tamassia
`
`Page 4
`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
`--------------------------------------------------
` P R O C E E D I N G S
` 9:09 a.m.
`--------------------------------------------------
` Whereupon,
` ROBERTO TAMASSIA,
` after having been first duly sworn or affirmed,
` was examined and did testify under oath as
` follows:
` EXAMINATION
` BY MR. ZEILBERGER: 09:09:30
` Q. Good morning. 09:09:31
` A. Hello. Good morning. 09:09:33
` Q. Can you please state your name and 09:09:35
` spell it for the record. 09:09:37
` A. Yes. Roberto Tamassia, R-o-b-e-r-t-o, 09:09:38
` T-a-m-a-s-s-i-a. 09:09:44
` Q. And you've been deposed before, 09:09:47
` correct? 09:09:49
` A. That's right. 09:09:52
` Q. When were you deposed? 09:09:53
` A. So I was deposed back in mid-November 09:09:54
` on the Apple v. VirnetX case by Joe, who is here. 09:09:58
` Q. Is that the only time you've been 09:10:05
` deposed? 09:10:08
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 800-702-9580
`
`Page 4 of 80
`
`

`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
`Roberto Tamassia
`
`Page 5
` A. I was deposed also a second time on a 09:10:09
` different matter on Dunstan v. ComScore. That 09:10:12
` was in December -- 09:10:24
` MR. ZEILBERGER: Can we take a quick 09:10:26
` break, please. 09:10:28
` (Off the record.)
` BY MR. ZEILBERGER: 09:12:19
` Q. You understand you're here today for 09:12:33
` the deposition in IPR2013-00866, IPR2015-00868, 09:12:35
` IPR2015-00870, and IPR2015-00871, correct? 09:12:42
` A. I guess so. I don't remember exactly 09:12:52
` the numbers, but if you show me my declaration, I 09:12:54
` can confirm. 09:12:58
` Q. So without your declaration, you won't 09:13:02
` know which proceedings your declaration is 09:13:04
` relative to? 09:13:08
` A. I remember which patents they are 09:13:09
` about. I don't remember the exact string of the 09:13:12
` proceedings. 09:13:15
` Q. So I'm handing you what's already been 09:13:34
` labeled as Exhibit 1005. 09:13:38
` So with having the declaration in 09:14:03
` front of you now, I'll ask you the question 09:14:05
` again. Do you understand you're here today for 09:14:08
` the deposition in IPR2015-00866, IPR2015-00868, 09:14:09
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 800-702-9580
`
`Page 5 of 80
`
`

`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
`Roberto Tamassia
`
`Page 6
` IPR2015-00870 and IPR2015-00871? 09:14:17
` A. Yes. 09:14:23
` Q. And do you understand that you're 09:14:27
` under oath today? 09:14:29
` A. Yes, I do. 09:14:30
` Q. At any time today if you need to take 09:14:33
` a break, please let me know, okay? 09:14:37
` A. Thank you. 09:14:40
` Q. But if there is a pending question, 09:14:40
` please answer the question first. 09:14:42
` A. Sure. 09:14:45
` Q. And if any of my questions are unclear 09:14:45
` to you, please let me know, otherwise I will 09:14:48
` assume that you understood the question. Okay? 09:14:51
` A. Sure. 09:14:53
` Q. Do you have any questions at this 09:14:54
` point? 09:14:55
` A. No. 09:14:56
` Q. Is there any reason you can't testify 09:14:57
` completely and accurately today? 09:15:00
` A. I cannot think of any reason. 09:15:03
` Q. Did you spend any time preparing for 09:15:08
` today's deposition? 09:15:10
` A. Yes. 09:15:13
` Q. When did you begin to prepare? 09:15:14
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 800-702-9580
`
`Page 6 of 80
`
`

`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
`Roberto Tamassia
`
`Page 7
` A. I began two days ago. 09:15:20
` Q. How much time did you spend preparing? 09:15:28
` A. About 12 hours. 09:15:41
` Q. Did you prepare with anyone? 09:15:49
` A. Yes. 09:15:52
` Q. Who did you prepare with? 09:15:54
` A. I prepared with counsel, with Tom and 09:15:56
` Scott, who are here. 09:16:01
` Q. Anybody else? 09:16:03
` A. No. 09:16:05
` Q. Did you review any documents? 09:16:12
` MR. BROUGHAN: Hold on. I'll caution 09:16:15
` the witness not to reveal the substance of 09:16:17
` any communications with counsel. But 09:16:20
` subject to that, you can answer the 09:16:22
` question. 09:16:24
` THE WITNESS: I reviewed my 09:16:35
` declaration and some of the relevant 09:16:37
` exhibits. 09:16:40
` BY MR. ZEILBERGER: 09:16:43
` Q. When you say "some of the relevant 09:16:44
` exhibits," what do you mean? 09:16:46
` A. Exhibits related to my declaration. 09:16:50
` Q. Do you remember which ones? 09:16:54
` A. Yes, I do. 09:16:57
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 800-702-9580
`
`Page 7 of 80
`
`

`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
`Roberto Tamassia
`
`Page 8
` Q. Can you please let me know which ones 09:16:58
` they were? 09:17:01
` A. The Beser patent. The Aventail 09:17:05
` manuals. RFC 2401. And the VirnetX patents 09:17:13
` '341, '131 and '0705. 09:17:27
` Q. Anything else? 09:17:37
` A. No. 09:17:39
` Q. Did you bring anything with you today 09:17:42
` to help you testify? 09:17:43
` A. I did not bring anything for the 09:17:56
` purpose of testifying. 09:17:58
` Q. So you didn't bring anything to help 09:18:11
` you testify? 09:18:13
` A. Right. 09:18:14
` MR. BROUGHAN: Objection; form. 09:18:18
` BY MR. ZEILBERGER: 09:18:28
` Q. So I previously handed you 09:18:28
` Exhibit 1005. Do you recognize this exhibit? 09:18:30
` A. The cover is the cover of my 09:18:35
` declaration. And I trust that this is the exact 09:18:39
` content that you gave me. 09:18:46
` Q. Do you have any reason to believe that 09:18:50
` this is not your declaration? 09:18:51
` A. I have no reason. 09:18:53
` Q. And on page 192, Paragraph 465, is 09:18:55
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 800-702-9580
`
`Page 8 of 80
`
`

`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
`Roberto Tamassia
`
`Page 9
` that your signature? 09:19:02
` A. Yes. 09:19:06
` Q. I'm handing the witness what's been 09:19:30
` previously marked as Exhibit 1006. This is the 09:19:32
` CV that was filed with your declaration, correct? 09:19:48
` A. I think so, yes. 09:19:59
` Q. Do you have any reason to believe it's 09:20:01
` not? 09:20:03
` A. I continuously update my CV, and I 09:20:05
` guess that this is the version that was included 09:20:10
` in the declaration since you are marking here as 09:20:12
` Exhibit 1006. 09:20:16
` Q. Can you read the first sentence under 09:20:18
` the "Brief Biography" section out loud? 09:20:20
` A. You want me to read the first sentence 09:20:31
` of the paragraph "Brief Biography"? Is that what 09:20:33
` you would like me to do? 09:20:37
` Q. Yes, please. 09:20:39
` A. "Roberto Tamassia is the Plastech 09:20:39
` professor of computer science and chairman of the 09:20:42
` department of computer science at Brown 09:20:46
` University." 09:20:50
` Q. Are you the chair of the department of 09:20:54
` computer science at Brown University? 09:20:56
` A. I'm currently not the chair. 09:20:59
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 800-702-9580
`
`Page 9 of 80
`
`

`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
`Roberto Tamassia
`
`Page 10
` Q. Were you the chair when you signed 09:21:02
` this declaration on March 12, 2015? 09:21:04
` A. I was not. I had already stepped down 09:21:14
` from that position. 09:21:17
` Q. Did you review this CV before it was 09:21:27
` filed? 09:21:31
` A. I don't think I reviewed it. I guess 09:22:13
` it was something that was on file at the time. 09:22:16
` Q. Can you turn to Paragraph 6 of your 09:22:38
` declaration? 09:22:41
` A. Yes. 09:22:51
` Q. What does Paragraph 6 say? 09:22:53
` A. It reads: "My CV is included as an 09:22:55
` appendix to this report." 09:22:58
` Q. So you didn't review the CV that you 09:23:06
` refer to in Paragraph 6? 09:23:08
` MR. BROUGHAN: Objection; form. 09:23:15
` BY MR. ZEILBERGER: 09:23:16
` Q. Did you understand the question? 09:23:17
` A. I do understand the question. 09:23:18
` I did check that it was a CV that I 09:24:39
` had previously provided to counsel as part of 09:24:42
` preparing the declaration. I did not recheck it 09:24:47
` line by line. 09:24:51
` Q. Section -- Strike that. 09:25:05
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 800-702-9580
`
`Page 10 of 80
`
`

`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
`Roberto Tamassia
`
`Page 11
` Do you have an updated CV? 09:25:07
` A. Yes. 09:25:09
` Q. Do you know what has changed since you 09:25:24
` filed this CV? 09:25:27
` A. There are new publications. There is 09:26:22
` one new grant. There are one or two patents 09:26:27
` where I am an inventor that were issued. And I 09:26:35
` likely fixed my brief bio to remove the reference 09:26:48
` to being chair of the department. 09:26:54
` Q. Have you submitted your updated CV in 09:27:04
` any proceeding? 09:27:07
` MR. BROUGHAN: Objection; form. 09:27:18
` THE WITNESS: Can you repeat the 09:27:22
` question? 09:27:23
` BY MR. ZEILBERGER: 09:27:27
` Q. Have you submitted your CV in any IPR 09:27:30
` proceeding? 09:27:35
` MR. BROUGHAN: Objection; form. 09:27:36
` THE WITNESS: Yes, I have submitted my 09:27:43
` CV as part of several IPR proceedings. 09:27:45
` BY MR. ZEILBERGER: 09:27:53
` Q. So your updated CV has been used in 09:27:54
` IPR proceedings? 09:27:59
` MR. BROUGHAN: Objection; form. 09:28:01
` Foundation. 09:28:09
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 800-702-9580
`
`Page 11 of 80
`
`

`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
`Roberto Tamassia
`
`Page 12
` THE WITNESS: Can you tell me which 09:28:17
` proceedings are you referring to? 09:28:18
` BY MR. ZEILBERGER: 09:28:22
` Q. Earlier you said: "Yes, I have 09:28:23
` submitted my CV as part of several IPR 09:28:27
` proceedings." Are you referring to the CV you 09:28:30
` have in front of you, Exhibit 1006, or are you 09:28:34
` referring to the updated CV that you referred to 09:28:38
` earlier? 09:28:41
` MR. BROUGHAN: Objection; form. 09:28:42
` Foundation. 09:28:43
` THE WITNESS: My answer was about a CV 09:28:51
` of mine being included together with the 09:28:53
` declaration. 09:29:02
` BY MR. ZEILBERGER: 09:29:06
` Q. To your knowledge, has your updated CV 09:29:07
` been used in any IPR proceeding? 09:29:10
` A. I don't remember providing an updated 09:29:34
` CV. 09:29:37
` Q. Why did you update your CV? 09:30:23
` MR. BROUGHAN: Objection; form. 09:30:37
` THE WITNESS: There are two main 09:30:54
` reasons for which I update my CV. One is 09:30:56
` because it is required by my employer to 09:31:01
` submit an updated CV on a yearly basis for 09:31:05
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 800-702-9580
`
`Page 12 of 80
`
`

`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
`Roberto Tamassia
`
`Page 13
` performance review purposes. 09:31:11
` An additional reason is to let others 09:31:14
` be aware of the latest developments of my 09:31:21
` work. And I post periodically updated 09:31:26
` versions on my web page. 09:31:35
` BY MR. ZEILBERGER: 09:31:44
` Q. Go to Section 4 of your declaration. 09:31:44
` A. Are you referring to Paragraph 4? 09:31:53
` Q. No, no. It would be on page 58, 09:31:56
` Section 4. 09:32:02
` A. Yes. 09:32:11
` Q. In Section 4 you provide what you 09:32:15
` refer to as a technical background, right? 09:32:17
` A. Yes. 09:32:21
` Q. And you have four subsections, 09:32:23
` computer network, Internet protocol suite TCP/IP, 09:32:29
` domain system DNS, and network encryption, 09:32:37
` correct? 09:32:44
` A. That's right. 09:32:45
` Q. Would you turn to Paragraph 154. 09:32:51
` A. 154? That's what you asked? 09:33:04
` Q. Yes. 09:33:07
` A. I have it in front of me. 09:33:07
` Q. Paragraph 154 says that "By connecting 09:33:12
` layer to LANs with layer 3 routing devices, 09:33:18
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 800-702-9580
`
`Page 13 of 80
`
`

`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
`Roberto Tamassia
`
`Page 14
` router's information from any device on any of 09:33:23
` the connected layer 2 LANs can be communicated to 09:33:27
` any other device on those connected LANs." 09:33:31
` Correct? 09:33:35
` A. Yes, that is the sentence. 09:33:37
` Q. Isn't it true that a device on one LAN 09:33:41
` will not necessarily be able to communicate with 09:33:44
` another device on another LAN? 09:33:48
` MR. BROUGHAN: Objection; form. 09:33:52
` Relevance. 09:33:57
` THE WITNESS: The sentence refers to 09:35:07
` the general routing mechanism on the 09:35:09
` Internet. It is a very brief general 09:35:14
` statement. It does not address all sorts of 09:35:22
` details and special circumstances where, for 09:35:26
` example, firewalls may prevent routing from 09:35:30
` one LAN to another LAN. 09:35:36
` BY MR. ZEILBERGER: 09:36:16
` Q. So you would agree that in 09:36:17
` Paragraph 154, when you refer to "any device" and 09:36:20
` "any other device," you were being over 09:36:26
` inclusive? 09:36:31
` MR. BROUGHAN: Objection; form. 09:36:37
` BY MR. ZEILBERGER: 09:36:38
` Q. Do you understand? 09:36:39
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 800-702-9580
`
`Page 14 of 80
`
`

`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
`Roberto Tamassia
`
`Page 15
` A. I understand your question. I'll say 09:36:39
` no. I was just sketching the general principles 09:38:24
` of communication across LANs through routing. 09:38:30
` Q. Can you turn to Paragraph 158 of your 09:39:24
` declaration? 09:39:28
` A. Yes. 09:39:40
` Q. You have a diagram there of a 09:39:42
` TCP three-way handshake, right? 09:39:45
` A. Yes. 09:39:53
` Q. The diagram has labels: Request 09:39:56
` connection, initialize connection, success code 09:40:00
` returned, and connection established. Right? 09:40:03
` A. Yes. 09:40:08
` Q. Request connection refers to a Host A 09:40:10
` requesting a connection with Host B, correct? 09:40:14
` A. Yes. 09:40:20
` Q. What did you mean when you said 09:40:25
` "initialize connection"? 09:40:26
` A. I was referring to the initial 09:41:44
` processing performed at Host B upon receiving the 09:41:46
` send message that will enable the continuation of 09:41:57
` the communication between A and B at a later 09:42:01
` stage. 09:42:06
` Q. Is your view consistent with what one 09:42:15
` of ordinary skill in the art would have 09:42:22
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 800-702-9580
`
`Page 15 of 80
`
`

`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
`Roberto Tamassia
`
`Page 16
` understood at the relevant time? 09:42:25
` MR. BROUGHAN: Objection; form. 09:42:28
` MR. ZEILBERGER: Let me rephrase that. 09:42:35
` BY MR. ZEILBERGER: 09:43:10
` Q. In Paragraph 41 of your declaration 09:43:10
` you say that it is your understanding that the 09:43:17
` claims of the '341 patent have a priority date of 09:43:23
` February 15, 2000. Correct? 09:43:30
` A. Can you repeat the question? 09:43:48
` Q. In Paragraph 41 of your declaration 09:43:51
` you say that it is your understanding that the 09:43:54
` claims of the '341 patent have a priority date of 09:43:58
` February 15, 2000. Correct? 09:44:02
` A. I will say that this paragraph refers 09:44:19
` to the two independent claims of the '341 patent 09:44:22
` as having priority date February 15, 2000. 09:44:30
` Q. In Paragraph 44 you say that the 09:44:50
` effective filing date of the '341 patent claims 09:44:53
` is not earlier than February 15, 2000. Correct? 09:44:56
` A. Yes, this is what Paragraph 44 -- This 09:45:22
` is what Paragraph 44 says, that the effective 09:45:26
` filing date of the claims in the '341 patent is 09:45:31
` not earlier than the date February 15, 2000. 09:45:35
` Q. And in Paragraph 49 you similarly say 09:45:39
` that "It is my understanding that the effective 09:45:42
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 800-702-9580
`
`Page 16 of 80
`
`

`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
`Roberto Tamassia
`
`Page 17
` filing date of the '131 patent claims is no 09:45:45
` earlier than February 15, 2000." 09:45:51
` A. That is what it says, Paragraph 49, 09:45:55
` yes. 09:45:59
` Q. And in Paragraph 54 you similarly say 09:46:01
` that "It is my understanding that the effective 09:46:06
` filing date of the '0705 patent claims is no 09:46:09
` earlier than February 15, 2000." 09:46:15
` A. Right. 09:46:21
` Q. So when I refer to the relevant time 09:46:25
` for purposes of today in my discussion today of 09:46:29
` IPR2015-00866, IPR2015-00868, IPR2015-00870 and 09:46:36
` IPR2015-00871, I'll be referring to the time you 09:46:44
` refer to in those paragraphs, February 15, 2000. 09:46:50
` Okay? 09:46:54
` A. Yes. 09:46:55
` MR. BROUGHAN: Objection; form. 09:46:56
` BY MR. ZEILBERGER: 09:46:57
` Q. Did you understand what I meant? 09:46:57
` MR. BROUGHAN: Objection; foundation. 09:47:08
` THE WITNESS: I believe we are 09:47:32
` referring to the background of someone of 09:47:34
` ordinary skill in the art as of this date, 09:47:36
` February 15, 2000. 09:47:39
` BY MR. ZEILBERGER: 09:47:47
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 800-702-9580
`
`Page 17 of 80
`
`

`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
`Roberto Tamassia
`
`Page 18
` Q. So if we turn back to Paragraph 158 -- 09:47:47
` A. Yes, I am there. 09:48:11
` Q. Do you recall that I asked you a 09:48:15
` question about initialize connection? 09:48:17
` A. Yes. 09:48:20
` Q. I asked you: "What did you mean when 09:48:21
` you said initialize connection?" 09:48:22
` And you answered: "I was referring to 09:48:24
` the initial processing performed at Host B upon 09:48:27
` receiving the send message that will enable the 09:48:31
` continuation of the communication between A and B 09:48:34
` at a later stage." 09:48:39
` Is that understanding of one of skill 09:48:47
` in the art around February 15, 2000? 09:48:49
` MR. BROUGHAN: Objection; form. 09:48:55
` Foundation. 09:48:56
` THE WITNESS: I believe that someone 09:49:09
` of ordinary skills in the art as of 09:49:10
` February 15, 2000, would be familiar with 09:49:13
` the TCP protocol, including the three-way 09:49:18
` handshake, and would be familiar with the 09:49:23
` messages that are exchanged in the TCP 09:49:26
` handshake and the processing of each host 09:49:32
` during the handshake. 09:49:36
` BY MR. ZEILBERGER: 09:49:37
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 800-702-9580
`
`Page 18 of 80
`
`

`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
`Roberto Tamassia
`
`Page 19
` Q. And it's your opinion that someone 09:49:38
` with that knowledge would have the same 09:49:41
` understanding you just provided me about 09:49:43
` initialize connection? 09:49:45
` MR. BROUGHAN: Objection; form. 09:49:57
` THE WITNESS: I believe the 09:50:21
` understanding of someone of ordinary skill 09:50:22
` in the art would be consistent with what 09:50:25
` I've just mentioned. 09:50:28
` BY MR. ZEILBERGER: 09:50:33
` Q. With what you mentioned about 09:50:34
` initialize connection? 09:50:35
` A. Yes. 09:50:38
` Q. When you provide in your diagram 09:50:43
` success code returned, are you referring to Host 09:50:45
` A returning an acknowledgment packet to Host B? 09:50:51
` A. I was referring to the processing 09:52:13
` performed at Host A upon receiving the SYN-ACK 09:52:16
` packet from Host B that results in sending by A 09:52:34
` the third message of the handshake, the ACK 09:52:42
` packet to B. 09:52:53
` Q. The last step in your diagram is 09:52:58
` connection established. Correct? 09:53:01
` A. Yes. 09:53:09
` Q. What did you mean by connection 09:53:13
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 800-702-9580
`
`Page 19 of 80
`
`

`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
`Roberto Tamassia
`
`Page 20
` established? 09:53:15
` A. It means that A and B have finished 09:53:59
` performing the handshake protocol and now can 09:54:03
` communicate with each other with the TCP 09:54:10
` protocol. 09:54:16
` Q. Is there any step that is performed 09:54:25
` after Host B receives the acknowledgment packet 09:54:32
` in order for a connection established to be 09:54:41
` performed? 09:54:44
` MR. BROUGHAN: Objection; form. 09:54:46
` THE WITNESS: On reviewing the ACK 09:57:16
` packet, it will check the validity of the 09:57:20
` packet according to the protocol and B will 09:57:23
` update the data structure associated with 09:57:28
` the connection. 09:57:36
` BY MR. ZEILBERGER: 09:57:46
` Q. Is the understanding you just provided 09:57:47
` me consistent with what one of ordinary skill in 09:57:49
` the art would have understood around February 15, 09:57:52
` 2000? 09:57:57
` A. Yes, I believe it will be consistent. 09:57:59
` Q. In Paragraphs 19 to 23 of your 09:58:37
` declaration you explain your understanding of the 09:58:42
` standards that govern a determination of whether 09:58:49
` a patent claim is anticipated by the prior art. 09:58:52
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 800-702-9580
`
`Page 20 of 80
`
`

`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
`Roberto Tamassia
`
`Page 21
` Correct? 09:58:55
` A. Yes. 09:59:04
` Q. In Paragraphs 24 through 39 of your 09:59:06
` declaration you explain your understanding of the 09:59:10
` standards that govern a determination of whether 09:59:13
` a patent claim would have been obvious to a 09:59:15
` person of ordinary skill in the fields of the 09:59:18
` invention at the time the invention was made. 09:59:23
` Correct? 09:59:26
` A. Paragraphs 24 through 39 cover my 09:59:49
` understanding of obviousness. 09:59:54
` Q. And when you say "obviousness," you 10:00:00
` mean your understanding of whether a patent claim 10:00:04
` would have been obvious to a person of ordinary 10:00:08
` skill in the field of the invention at the time 10:00:13
` the invention was made? 10:00:15
` A. Right. As I say in Paragraph 24. 10:00:17
` Q. You've testified before that you have 10:01:34
` no personal knowledge about the RFC publication 10:01:36
` process, correct? 10:01:42
` MR. BROUGHAN: Objection; form. 10:01:46
` Foundation. 10:01:48
` THE WITNESS: I understand that I 10:04:46
` previously testified that I am familiar with 10:04:48
` the RFC publication process, with how RFC 10:04:52
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 800-702-9580
`
`Page 21 of 80
`
`

`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
`Roberto Tamassia
`
`Page 22
` publications are posted an

This document is available on Docket Alarm but you must sign up to view it.


Or .

Accessing this document will incur an additional charge of $.

After purchase, you can access this document again without charge.

Accept $ Charge
throbber

Still Working On It

This document is taking longer than usual to download. This can happen if we need to contact the court directly to obtain the document and their servers are running slowly.

Give it another minute or two to complete, and then try the refresh button.

throbber

A few More Minutes ... Still Working

It can take up to 5 minutes for us to download a document if the court servers are running slowly.

Thank you for your continued patience.

This document could not be displayed.

We could not find this document within its docket. Please go back to the docket page and check the link. If that does not work, go back to the docket and refresh it to pull the newest information.

Your account does not support viewing this document.

You need a Paid Account to view this document. Click here to change your account type.

Your account does not support viewing this document.

Set your membership status to view this document.

With a Docket Alarm membership, you'll get a whole lot more, including:

  • Up-to-date information for this case.
  • Email alerts whenever there is an update.
  • Full text search for other cases.
  • Get email alerts whenever a new case matches your search.

Become a Member

One Moment Please

The filing “” is large (MB) and is being downloaded.

Please refresh this page in a few minutes to see if the filing has been downloaded. The filing will also be emailed to you when the download completes.

Your document is on its way!

If you do not receive the document in five minutes, contact support at support@docketalarm.com.

Sealed Document

We are unable to display this document, it may be under a court ordered seal.

If you have proper credentials to access the file, you may proceed directly to the court's system using your government issued username and password.


Access Government Site

We are redirecting you
to a mobile optimized page.





Document Unreadable or Corrupt

Refresh this Document
Go to the Docket

We are unable to display this document.

Refresh this Document
Go to the Docket