· · · · ·UNITED STATES PATENT AND TRADEMARK OFFICE
`
`· · · · ·BEFORE THE PATENT TRIAL AND APPEAL BOARD
`
`SLAYBACK PHARMA LLC,· · · · · )
`· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · )
`· · · · · · · · · Petitioner, )
`· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · )
`· · · v.· · · · · · · · · · · ) Patent No. 9,815,827
`· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · )
`SUMITOMO DAINIPPON PHARMA· · ·)
`CO., LTD,· · · · · · · · · · ·)
`· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · )
`· · · · · · · · Patent Owner. )
`______________________________)
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`· · · · · · · ·VIDEOCONFERENCE DEPOSITION OF
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`· · · · · · · · · ·THOMAS R. KOSTEN, M.D.
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`· · · · · · · · WEDNESDAY, FEBRUARY 17, 2021
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`· STENOGRAPHICALLY REPORTED BY:
`· CHERYL M. HAAB, RPR, CCRR, CLR
`· CSR No. 13600
`· 21-96863
`
`1
`
`Exhibit 2134
`Slayback v. Sumitomo
`IPR2020-01053
`
`
`
`· · · · ·BEFORE THE PATENT TRIAL AND APPEAL BOARD
`
`SLAYBACK PHARMA LLC,· · · · · )
`· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · )
`· · · · · · · · · Petitioner, )
`· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · )
`· · · v.· · · · · · · · · · · ) Patent No. 9,815,827
`· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · )
`SUMITOMO DAINIPPON PHARMA· · ·)
`CO., LTD,· · · · · · · · · · ·)
`· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · )
`· · · · · · · · Patent Owner. )
`______________________________)
`
`· · · · · · · ·VIDEOCONFERENCE DEPOSITION OF
`
`· · · · · · · · · ·THOMAS R. KOSTEN, M.D.
`
`· · · · · · · · WEDNESDAY, FEBRUARY 17, 2021
`
`· STENOGRAPHICALLY REPORTED BY:
`· CHERYL M. HAAB, RPR, CCRR, CLR
`· CSR No. 13600
`· 21-96863
`
`1
`
`Exhibit 2134
`Slayback v. Sumitomo
`IPR2020-01053
`
`
`
`·1· · · · · ·UNITED STATES PATENT AND TRADEMARK OFFICE
`
`·2· · · · · ·BEFORE THE PATENT TRIAL AND APPEAL BOARD
`
`·3
`· · SLAYBACK PHARMA LLC,· · · · · )
`·4· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · )
`· · · · · · · · · · · Petitioner, )
`·5· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · )
`· · · · · v.· · · · · · · · · · · ) Patent No. 9,815,827
`·6· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · )
`· · SUMITOMO DAINIPPON PHARMA· · ·)
`·7· CO., LTD,· · · · · · · · · · ·)
`· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · )
`·8· · · · · · · · · Patent Owner. )
`· · ______________________________)
`·9
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`10
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`11
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`12
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`13· · · · · · · · ·VIDEOCONFERENCE DEPOSITION OF
`
`14· · · · · · · · · · ·THOMAS R. KOSTEN, M.D.
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`15· · · · · · · · · WEDNESDAY, FEBRUARY 17, 2021
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`16
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`· · · STENOGRAPHICALLY REPORTED BY:
`24· · CHERYL M. HAAB, RPR, CCRR, CLR
`· · · CSR No. 13600
`25· · 21-96863
`
`2
`
`
`
`·1· · · · · ·UNITED STATES PATENT AND TRADEMARK OFFICE
`
`·2· · · · · ·BEFORE THE PATENT TRIAL AND APPEAL BOARD
`
`·3
`· · SLAYBACK PHARMA LLC,· · · · · )
`·4· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · )
`· · · · · · · · · · · Petitioner, )
`·5· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · )
`· · · · · v.· · · · · · · · · · · ) Patent No. 9,815,827
`·6· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · )
`· · SUMITOMO DAINIPPON PHARMA· · ·)
`·7· CO., LTD,· · · · · · · · · · ·)
`· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · )
`·8· · · · · · · · · Patent Owner. )
`· · ______________________________)
`·9
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`10
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`11
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`13· · · · · · ·VIDEOCONFERENCE DEPOSITION OF THOMAS R. KOSTEN,
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`14· · M.D., taken on Wednesday, February 17, 2021, at
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`15· · 7:07 a.m. PT, before Cheryl M. Haab, Certified Shorthand
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`16· · Reporter No. 13600, in and for the State of California.
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`THE SULLIVAN GROUP OF COURT REPORTERS
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`·1· · · · · · · · · · A P P E A R A N C E S
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`·2
`· · ·For Petitioner:
`·3
`· · · · ·FISH & RICHARDSON
`·4· · · ·BY:· W. CHAD SHEAR, ESQ.
`· · · · · · · MICHAEL KANE, ESQ.
`·5· · · ·12860 El Camino Real, Suite 400
`· · · · ·San Diego, California 92130
`·6· · · ·858.678.5070
`· · · · ·shear@fr.com
`·7· · · ·kane@fr.com
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`·8
`· · ·For Patent Owner:
`·9
`· · · · ·WINDELS MARX
`10· · · ·BY:· LOUIS H. WEINSTEIN, ESQ.
`· · · · ·One Giralda Farms
`11· · · ·Madison, New Jersey 07940
`· · · · ·973.966.3236
`12· · · ·lweinstein@windelsmarx.com
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`·1· · · · · · · · · · · · · I N D E X
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`·2
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`·3· ·WITNESS: Thomas R. Kosten, M.D.
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`·4· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · ·PAGE
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`·5· ·Examination By Mr. Shear· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · ·5
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`10· · · · · · · · · · · INDEX TO EXHIBITS
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`11
`· · ·EXHIBIT NO.· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · ·PAGE
`12
`· · ·Exhibit 2· · ·"Declaration of Dr. Thomas R.· · · · · ·10
`13· · · · · · · · ·Kosten, M.D." (Slayback Exhibit
`· · · · · · · · · ·1002)
`14
`· · ·Exhibit 3· · ·United States Patent No. US· · · · · · ·47
`15· · · · · · · · ·9,815,827 B2 (Slayback Exhibit
`· · · · · · · · · ·1001)
`16
`· · ·Exhibit 5· · ·United States Patent No. 5,532,372· · · 70
`17· · · · · · · · ·(Slayback Exhibit 1009)
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`18· ·Exhibit 8· · ·"Stahl's Essential· · · · · · · · · · · 67
`· · · · · · · · · ·Psychopharmacology" (Exhibit 2027)
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`·1· · · · · WEDNESDAY, FEBRUARY 17, 2021, 7:07 A.M. PT
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`·2· · · · · · · · · · · · · ·--oOo--
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`·3· · · · · · · · · · · · · Whereupon,
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`·4· · · · · · · · · ·THOMAS R. KOSTEN, M.D.,
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`·5· · · · · · · ·having been called as a witness,
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`·6· · · · · ·was duly sworn and testified as follows:
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`·7· · · · · · · · · · · · · ·--oOo--
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`·8· · · · · · · · · · · · ·EXAMINATION
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`·9· ·BY MR. SHEAR:
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`10· · · ·Q· · Thank you.· Good morning.· Dr. Kosten, is it --
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`11· ·do you prefer Dr. Kosten or Professor Kosten?
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`12· · · ·A· · Doctor.· Or just Tom is fine too.
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`13· · · ·Q· · The formalities of the proceeding will prevent
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`14· ·me from using your first name, but I do appreciate the
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`15· ·offer.
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`16· · · · · · My name is Chad Shear.· I'm a principal of Fish
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`17· ·& Richardson.· Joining me today is Michael Kane, another
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`18· ·partner of mine.· And we together represent Sumitomo
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`19· ·Dainippon Pharma, the patent owner in this proceeding.
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`20· · · · · · And, Lou, I don't know if you need to announce
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`21· ·yourself for the record or not, but feel free.
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`22· · · · · · MR. WEINSTEIN:· I'm Louis Weinstein from
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`23· ·Windels Marx, and I'm representing the petitioner and
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`24· ·Dr. Kosten to the extent he needs representation at this
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`25· ·deposition.
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`·1· ·BY MR. SHEAR:
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`·2· · · ·Q· · So, Dr. Kosten, I know you've been -- you've
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`·3· ·been deposed before.· My guess is this is probably an
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`·4· ·unusual manner for it to occur.· We sent in advance of
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`·5· ·the deposition today a box of exhibits that you should
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`·6· ·have received.
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`·7· · · · · · Do you have that box?
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`·8· · · ·A· · I have the box.
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`·9· · · ·Q· · Okay.· Can you go ahead and open it.
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`10· · · ·A· · Okay.
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`11· · · ·Q· · And just for housekeeping, let's just open it
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`12· ·now and get it out.
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`13· · · ·A· · Okay.· There's a whole bunch in there.
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`14· · · ·Q· · Yeah, no.· Take your time.
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`15· · · ·A· · Looks like 12 of those folders.
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`16· · · ·Q· · Perfect.· I can't say that we're going to be
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`17· ·using them all today, but they're there if we need them.
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`18· · · · · · Before we pull any documents out, just a
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`19· ·couple -- I'm going to call them ground rules, but it's
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`20· ·not really rules.· It's more so that you and I are on
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`21· ·the same page and understand the proceeding.
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`22· · · · · · So -- so I know that you've been deposed
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`23· ·before, but just to get a few things on the record.
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`24· · · · · · So the -- this is made all the more challenging
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`25· ·by the fact that we're all sort of doing this virtually.
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`·1· ·And in a real deposition, if we were sitting in a
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`·2· ·conference room together, it might be okay if you nodded
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`·3· ·your head as an answer, but in this setting, it's really
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`·4· ·important that you answer the questions orally.
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`·5· · · ·A· · Very good.
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`·6· · · ·Q· · And I'll do my best to remind you if we slip.
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`·7· · · · · · Dr. Kosten, I'll do my best to take a break
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`·8· ·about every hour.· That being said, if at any point for
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`·9· ·any reason you need a break, just sort of let me know,
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`10· ·and we'll go ahead and take a break.· The only thing
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`11· ·that I ask is that you answer whatever question is
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`12· ·pending before we take a break.
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`13· · · ·A· · Certainly.
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`14· · · ·Q· · I'm going to do my best to ask clear questions.
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`15· ·I can't promise I'll always succeed with that.· So if
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`16· ·there's anything that's unclear or confusing to you
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`17· ·about a question that I ask, will you let me know?
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`18· · · ·A· · I will certainly let you know.
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`19· · · ·Q· · Thank you.· I'm more than happy to rephrase the
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`20· ·question or find some other way to ask it so that it's
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`21· ·clear.
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`22· · · · · · So is it fair, then, that we'll have an
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`23· ·understanding that -- if you answer my question without
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`24· ·seeking clarification or without needing it rephrased,
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`25· ·is it fair that we'll then assume that you understood
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`·1· ·the question?
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`·2· · · ·A· · Yes, I think that's fair, unless my attorney
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`·3· ·interrupts.· I don't know if he's my attorney.· But the
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`·4· ·other side interrupts or says some objection or
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`·5· ·something.
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`·6· · · ·Q· · Sure.· Of course.· And that's a good lead-in to
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`·7· ·sort of the idea of objections.
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`·8· · · · · · So from time to time, Mr. Weinstein might make
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`·9· ·objections.· That doesn't mean that you don't have to
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`10· ·answer the question.· He's just lodging an objection for
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`11· ·the record, and I would still appreciate an answer.
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`12· · · · · · MR. WEINSTEIN:· I just want to say one thing
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`13· ·for the record.· Dr. Kosten is a medical doctor and has
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`14· ·other responsibilities.· So, Dr. Kosten -- so if for any
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`15· ·reason something comes up that you absolutely have to
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`16· ·just stop, that takes precedence, of course.
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`17· · · · · · THE WITNESS:· Thank you.
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`18· ·BY MR. SHEAR:
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`19· · · ·Q· · Dr. Kosten, is there anything, medically or
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`20· ·otherwise, that would prevent you from testifying
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`21· ·truthfully and honestly today?
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`22· · · ·A· · No.
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`23· · · ·Q· · What did you do to prepare for the deposition
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`24· ·today?
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`25· · · · · · MR. WEINSTEIN:· Excuse me.· I'm going to
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`·1· ·caution the witness to speak generally and not to
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`·2· ·disclose the substance of any communications that you
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`·3· ·may have had with counsel.· But you can proceed.
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`·4· · · · · · THE WITNESS:· I read through -- in preparation
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`·5· ·for today's deposition, I read through a variety of
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`·6· ·exhibits that were listed in the -- I think it's called
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`·7· ·a declaration that I sent you.· I then reviewed several
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`·8· ·of them with Mr. Weinstein that in particular he
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`·9· ·needed --
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`10· · · · · · MR. WEINSTEIN:· Excuse me.· I want to
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`11· ·caution -- you don't have to go over which particular.
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`12· ·You should not say which particular documents you
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`13· ·reviewed with me.
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`14· · · · · · THE WITNESS:· Very good.
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`15· · · · · · There were areas of law that I didn't
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`16· ·understand or know about, and he instructed me about
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`17· ·some of those terminologies.· Then I, of course, read
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`18· ·through my own declaration several times just to make
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`19· ·sure it was saying what I thought.
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`20· ·BY MR. SHEAR:
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`21· · · ·Q· · Sure.· Okay.
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`22· · · · · · With that in mind, can you reach into the box,
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`23· ·Exhibit No. 2.· So the exhibit -- everything should be
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`24· ·premarked.· And I don't know if your folders are flagged
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`25· ·or not.
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`·1· · · ·A· · They are.
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`·2· · · ·Q· · Exhibit 2 should be your declaration.
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`·3· · · ·A· · Okay.
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`·4· · · · · · (Petitioner's Exhibit 2 was marked.)
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`·5· · · · · · MR. WEINSTEIN:· And for the record -- I'm sure
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`·6· ·Mr. Shear will be careful about this.· Some of these
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`·7· ·documents have Slayback exhibit numbers that start with
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`·8· ·1000, and some are in red like this one is, Exhibit 2.
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`·9· ·So let's just try to be clear that when we have an
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`10· ·exhibit number, we know which one we're talking about.
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`11· · · · · · So what's been marked in a little stamp as
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`12· ·Exhibit 2 for purposes of the deposition should be,
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`13· ·Dr. Kosten, your declaration, which was Slayback
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`14· ·Exhibit 1002 to its petition.
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`15· · · · · · Let me know if you have that in front of you.
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`16· · · · · · THE WITNESS:· I do.
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`17· ·BY MR. SHEAR:
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`18· · · ·Q· · Can you just take a look at that, Dr. Kosten,
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`19· ·and confirm for me it is your declaration?
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`20· · · ·A· · Yes, I was just doing that.· And, in fact, it
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`21· ·looks like my declaration.· I haven't read through every
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`22· ·page of this.· And it's the declaration which includes
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`23· ·all of the things specific to this case.· And at the end
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`24· ·of it is the -- my CV.
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`25· · · · · · And then there was a -- let's see.· I think
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`·1· ·there's another section or two that lists the things I
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`·2· ·reviewed for this case.· Let me see if that's in this
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`·3· ·one.· Yeah, there's an Exhibit C, which is the materials
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`·4· ·that I reviewed; and Exhibit B, which is a list of
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`·5· ·testimonies that I have.
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`·6· · · · · · And -- let's see.· Is there -- I guess
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`·7· ·Exhibit A is my CV itself.· I think that's all I can
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`·8· ·find in here.
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`·9· · · ·Q· · Okay.· Perfect.
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`10· · · · · · So, Dr. Kosten, one thing I notice as I look at
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`11· ·the way the exhibits have been marked for us is that the
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`12· ·deposition exhibits are tiny and hard to see.· And, of
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`13· ·course, the IPR exhibit numbers are big and bolded and
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`14· ·easier to follow.
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`15· · · · · · So what I'd like to do, because I think every
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`16· ·document that I'm going to use with you today for the
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`17· ·most part with the exception of only one that I can
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`18· ·really think of, is an -- is an exhibit already on
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`19· ·record in the IPR.· So what I'd like to do is refer to
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`20· ·the exhibit numbers for the IPR as opposed to the
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`21· ·deposition exhibits.
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`22· · · · · · We'll be really clear every time we're talking
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`23· ·about a document, exactly what we're talking about so
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`24· ·there won't be any confusion.· I just think the record
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`25· ·might be clearer, because one thing I am going to do is
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`·1· ·if you look at your declaration, you'll see that the
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`·2· ·County of LA -- when it filed, it numbered all of the
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`·3· ·pages in bold in sort of the lower left-hand corner.
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`·4· · · ·A· · Right.
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`·5· · · ·Q· · And I'm going to refer to those page numbers
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`·6· ·because it's just easier to find stuff.
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`·7· · · ·A· · Oh, great.· Okay.
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`·8· · · ·Q· · So for the most part, we'll probably end up
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`·9· ·using just the IPR exhibit number.· I'll be clear what
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`10· ·it is we're talking about so there's no confusion three
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`11· ·weeks from now when people are reading this thing.
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`12· · · ·A· · So when you say stamp -- the thing that says
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`13· ·Slayback Exhibit 1002?
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`14· · · ·Q· · Yeah.· Exactly.· And that's exactly how I'll
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`15· ·refer to it.· I'll say, "Slayback Exhibit 1002" so it's
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`16· ·clear what we're talking about.
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`17· · · · · · MR. WEINSTEIN:· I'm going to ask the court
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`18· ·reporter, please -- I'm sure she will.· But somewhere in
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`19· ·the front, there'll be some little index or something
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`20· ·which we'll cross-reference.· If it's Slayback
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`21· ·Exhibit 1002, it will say Kosten Exhibit 2; I'm not
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`22· ·always going to match up that way.· But will the court
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`23· ·reporter be doing that somewhere?
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`24· · · · · · (Discussion off the record.)
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`25· ·///
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`·1· ·BY MR. SHEAR:
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`·2· · · ·Q· · Okay.· So, Dr. Kosten, before we just took that
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`·3· ·break, you should have in front of you Slayback
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`·4· ·Exhibit 1002, which is your declaration.
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`·5· · · · · · Do you still have that in front of you?
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`·6· · · ·A· · I do.
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`·7· · · ·Q· · Dr. Kosten, when was the last time that you
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`·8· ·read your declaration?
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`·9· · · ·A· · Last evening.· I didn't read the whole thing.
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`10· ·I just tried to pick a few high points.
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`11· · · ·Q· · Okay.· And in reviewing your declaration, did
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`12· ·you see any corrections or changes you wanted to make?
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`13· · · ·A· · There was some things that I probably should --
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`14· ·they weren't big things.· If you want me to try to look
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`15· ·them up right now, they were -- like, one thing that was
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`16· ·a little -- I think left out is there was a mention
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`17· ·of -- what's the name of that antipsychotic?
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`18· · · · · · Well, anyway, an antipsychotic, and there was
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`19· ·an article about it.· And also should have said 2001,
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`20· ·which was the date of that article, and that was a
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`21· ·little left out.
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`22· · · · · · And there was something -- it had to do with
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`23· ·Saji -- Saji -- anyway, that -- that amendment.· And
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`24· ·there's this compound 105 versus 101, and it -- it's
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`25· ·still a little unclear which one they meant, but I think
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`·1· ·I picked one of them which is 101, and it could have
`
`·2· ·been 105.· So they're very minor.
`
`·3· · · ·Q· · And is there any -- well, let me ask this --
`
`·4· ·ask it this way:· Is there anything in your declaration
`
`·5· ·that you feel needs to be corrected or changed that goes
`
`·6· ·to the substance of your opinions?
`
`·7· · · ·A· · No.
`
`·8· · · ·Q· · Okay.· Okay.· And is your declaration, Slayback
`
`·9· ·Exhibit 1002, a complete set of the opinions that you're
`
`10· ·offering in this proceeding to date?
`
`11· · · ·A· · Yes, unless there's some new information you
`
`12· ·want me to integrate into it.
`
`13· · · ·Q· · Okay.· But as of sitting here right now, it's a
`
`14· ·complete set of your opinions?
`
`15· · · ·A· · Correct.
`
`16· · · ·Q· · In your -- so in Slayback Exhibit 1002, if you
`
`17· ·could go back to Exhibit B, which begins at page 146.
`
`18· · · ·A· · Certainly.· Let me get this in front of me.
`
`19· · · · · · MR. WEINSTEIN:· Tom, just for the record, mine
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`20· ·is double-sided.· Is yours double-sided?· You have all
`
`21· ·the pages?
`
`22· · · · · · THE WITNESS:· It is double-sided.· That why I'm
`
`23· ·looking.· I've got Exhibit C in front of me, so get to
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`24· ·B.· I'm going from the back because it's easier.
`
`25· · · · · · All right.· I now have Exhibit B in front of
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`THE SULLIVAN GROUP OF COURT REPORTERS
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`·1· ·me.· It says Slayback Exhibit 1002, page 146 and
`
`·2· ·page 147.
`
`·3· ·BY MR. SHEAR:
`
`·4· · · ·Q· · Dr. Kosten, can you describe for me what
`
`·5· ·Exhibit B is?
`
`·6· · · ·A· · It is a list of expert testimonies that I made
`
`·7· ·from 2014 until 2020.· And then there's some annotations
`
`·8· ·on it where "D" stands for a deposition.· And if there's
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`·9· ·a "C" there, then it's one where I also had a court
`
`10· ·appearance.
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`11· · · ·Q· · Okay.· Dr. Kosten, let me ask it this way:· Are
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`12· ·any of these patent cases?
`
`13· · · ·A· · No.
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`14· · · ·Q· · Have you ever served as an expert witness in a
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`15· ·proceeding involving a patent?
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`16· · · ·A· · No.
`
`17· · · ·Q· · So this is your first?
`
`18· · · ·A· · This is my first.
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`19· · · ·Q· · Okay.· If you go to -- and just turn over the
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`20· ·page to Exhibit C, which is at page 148 of Slayback
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`21· ·Exhibit 1002.
`
`22· · · · · · Do you see Exhibit C?
`
`23· · · ·A· · Yes.
`
`24· · · ·Q· · And could you describe for me what Exhibit C
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`25· ·is?
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`·1· · · ·A· · Exhibit C is a listing of the materials that I
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`·2· ·was given to review, which I did.· And they are listed
`
`·3· ·by, I guess, the Slayback exhibit numbers, and then
`
`·4· ·there's a description of them.
`
`·5· · · ·Q· · Okay.· You said that these exhibits were
`
`·6· ·exhibits that were given to you to review.
`
`·7· · · · · · Given to you by whom?
`
`·8· · · ·A· · Mr. Weinstein.
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`·9· · · ·Q· · Okay.· And are there any exhibits on this list
`
`10· ·that you contributed on your own, or did they all come
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`11· ·from Mr. Weinstein?
`
`12· · · ·A· · They all came from Mr. Weinstein.· There's
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`13· ·nothing in here that I looked up to provide.
`
`14· · · ·Q· · Okay.
`
`15· · · ·A· · I looked them up once I got them, but...
`
`16· · · ·Q· · Sure.
`
`17· · · · · · And you reviewed -- you reviewed all the
`
`18· ·exhibits in Exhibit C to your declaration; is that
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`19· ·correct?
`
`20· · · ·A· · That's correct.
`
`21· · · ·Q· · Doctor, when I look at Exhibit B -- so
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`22· ·Exhibit B was the list of cases where you provided
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`23· ·previous testimony.
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`24· · · ·A· · Yes.
`
`25· · · ·Q· · I don't see Slayback listed; right?
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`THE SULLIVAN GROUP OF COURT REPORTERS
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`·1· · · ·A· · You're correct on that.· Yes.
`
`·2· · · ·Q· · Have you, prior to this -- prior to this
`
`·3· ·proceeding, have you had any interaction with Slayback?
`
`·4· · · ·A· · The company, you mean?
`
`·5· · · ·Q· · Yes.
`
`·6· · · ·A· · No.
`
`·7· · · ·Q· · Okay.
`
`·8· · · · · · MR. WEINSTEIN:· I'm going to ask Dr. Kosten to
`
`·9· ·pause after a question is asked just to give me a chance
`
`10· ·to object if I need to.· But please proceed with your
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`11· ·next question, Mr. Shear.
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`12· ·BY MR. SHEAR:
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`13· · · ·Q· · Dr. Kosten, prior to this proceeding, had you
`
`14· ·had any interactions with any individuals from Slayback?
`
`15· · · ·A· · I'm leaving the pause.
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`16· · · · · · I had no interactions, unless you consider
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`17· ·Mr. Weinstein somehow related to Slayback.
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`18· · · ·Q· · Prior to this proceeding, had you had any
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`19· ·interactions with Mr. Weinstein?
`
`20· · · ·A· · Prior to this case?
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`21· · · ·Q· · Yes.
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`22· · · ·A· · Prior to this case, no.
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`23· · · ·Q· · So this case -- just so the record is clear,
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`24· ·this case is the first time that you've either worked
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`25· ·with either Mr. Weinstein or Slayback?
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`·1· · · ·A· · That is correct.
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`·2· · · ·Q· · The law firm that Mr. Weinstein is part of,
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`·3· ·Windels Marx -- have you had any interactions with
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`·4· ·attorneys at Windels Marx before this case?
`
`·5· · · ·A· · No, I have not.
`
`·6· · · ·Q· · Before this case, had you had any interactions
`
`·7· ·with anyone at Sunovion?
`
`·8· · · ·A· · There is probably one or two drug company
`
`·9· ·representatives over the last 40 years that I talked to.
`
`10· · · ·Q· · So, like, a sales representative would come
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`11· ·into your office and talk to you about a product?· Is
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`12· ·that what you're referring to?
`
`13· · · ·A· · Yes.
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`14· · · ·Q· · And prior to this case, had you had any
`
`15· ·interaction or involvement with anyone from DSP?
`
`16· · · · · · MR. WEINSTEIN:· Objection.· What is DSP,
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`17· ·please?
`
`18· · · · · · MR. SHEAR:· Oh, I'm sorry.· DSP is -- so if you
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`19· ·look at -- that's a fair objection.
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`20· · · · · · If you -- if you look at the cover of your
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`21· ·declaration, Dr. Kosten.
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`22· · · · · · THE WITNESS:· Yes.
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`23· ·BY MR. SHEAR:
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`24· · · ·Q· · So you'll see the parties in this case are
`
`25· ·Slayback Pharma versus Sumitomo Dainippon Pharma.
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`·1· ·Sumitomo Dainippon Pharma -- because it's a mouthful, we
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`·2· ·colloquially refer to that entity as "DSP."
`
`·3· · · ·A· · I had never heard of them before.
`
`·4· · · ·Q· · If I -- throughout the deposition today, I
`
`·5· ·might use the acronym DSP.· Can we -- can we all
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`·6· ·understand when I say DSP, I mean Sumitomo Dainippon
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`·7· ·Pharma?
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`·8· · · ·A· · I will do my best to remember that.
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`·9· · · ·Q· · And if you need to ask me who they are again,
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`10· ·feel free.· But I -- Sumitomo Dainippon Pharma is so
`
`11· ·much to say that I try to avoid it.
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`12· · · · · · MR. WEINSTEIN:· Just for the record, it's
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`13· ·Sumitomo Dainippon Pharma Company Limited, and that's
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`14· ·the patent owner.
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`15· · · · · · MR. SHEAR:· Correct.
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`16· ·BY MR. SHEAR:
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`17· · · ·Q· · Doctor -- Dr. Kosten, just one or two more
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`18· ·questions about Exhibit C just so I make sure I
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`19· ·understand.
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`20· · · · · · So Exhibit C to your declaration, Slayback
`
`21· ·Exhibit 1002 on pages 148 and 149, 150 and 151 -- I
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`22· ·think you testified a few moments ago that these were
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`23· ·the materials that you considered in reaching your
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`24· ·opinions; correct?
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`25· · · ·A· · Correct.
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`·1· · · ·Q· · And I just want to make sure:· This is a
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`·2· ·complete list of all of the materials you considered; is
`
`·3· ·that correct?
`
`·4· · · ·A· · That's correct.
`
`·5· · · ·Q· · Dr. Kosten, I'd like to talk a little bit with
`
`·6· ·you about your background and your education.
`
`·7· · · · · · Your undergraduate degree -- and I'm looking at
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`·8· ·your CV, which begins on page 54 of Slayback
`
`·9· ·Exhibit 1002.
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`10· · · ·A· · Very good.
`
`11· · · ·Q· · You list a biophysics degree from Rensselaer
`
`12· ·Polytechnic Institute in Troy, New York.
`
`13· · · · · · At a high level, Doctor, can you describe
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`14· ·what -- the types of things that you study in getting a
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`15· ·biophysics degree?
`
`16· · · ·A· · Yes.· I first studied fundamental physics. I
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`17· ·also had a degree in biology.· The specific things I
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`18· ·studied while I was there:· I worked with electron
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`19· ·microscopy.· And scanning electron microscopy was just
`
`20· ·developing at that time, and that was a biophysical
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`21· ·device or technique.· And I was studying muscles and how
`
`22· ·actin and myosin act on each other.
`
`23· · · · · · I did a thesis in my senior year, and used a
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`24· ·variety of devices to understand how it worked, which
`
`25· ·included X-ray crystallography and this new technique of
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`·1· ·scanning electron microscopy.
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`·2· · · ·Q· · What was the subject matter -- after you
`
`·3· ·received your undergraduate degree, you have a master's
`
`·4· ·from Yale.· What was the subject matter of your
`
`·5· ·master's?
`
`·6· · · ·A· · The master's at Yale is a -- called an
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`·7· ·in camera degree.· It's given to all of the faculty who
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`·8· ·become a tenured faculty at Yale University as a way to,
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`·9· ·I guess, keep you locked in to the university as an
`
`10· ·official graduate.
`
`11· · · ·Q· · Okay.· And obviously you have a medical degree
`
`12· ·from Cornell; correct?
`
`13· · · ·A· · Correct.
`
`14· · · ·Q· · Fair to say, you don't have a degree in
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`15· ·chemistry; correct?
`
`16· · · ·A· · That's correct.
`
`17· · · ·Q· · And you wouldn't consider yourself an expert in
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`18· ·chemistry?
`
`19· · · ·A· · That's correct.
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`20· · · ·Q· · And you're not offering any opinions here today
`
`21· ·from the perspective of an expert in chemistry; is that
`
`22· ·correct?
`
`23· · · ·A· · That's correct.· Only what I read in articles
`
`24· ·that are included in this.
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`25· · · ·Q· · And obviously -- it probably goes without
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`THE SULLIVAN GROUP OF COURT REPORTERS
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`·1· ·saying, Dr. Kosten, but you didn't go to law school?
`
`·2· · · ·A· · That's correct.
`
`·3· · · ·Q· · Not a lawyer?
`
`·4· · · ·A· · That's correct.
`
`·5· · · ·Q· · And you're not offering any legal opinions here
`
`·6· ·today; is that correct?
`
`·7· · · ·A· · I don't know what you call the instructions
`
`·8· ·that I got about terminology.· I did learn stuff about
`
`·9· ·patent law in the process of this, but I'm certainly not
`
`10· ·an expert.· I relied on my counsel to educate me.
`
`11· · · ·Q· · Sure.· But you're not offering any opinions
`
`12· ·today from the perspective of an expert in law or patent
`
`13· ·law?
`
`14· · · ·A· · I don't think so.
`
`15· · · ·Q· · Dr. Kosten, do you have any patents yourself?
`
`16· · · ·A· · Yes.· I've had them, but they've not been kept
`
`17· ·up.· The university decided they weren't worth
`
`18· ·maintaining.
`
`19· · · ·Q· · And what were the areas of those patents?
`
`20· · · ·A· · Vaccines.
`
`21· · · ·Q· · And when -- when -- were those vaccines that
`
`22· ·actually made it to market?
`
`23· · · ·A· · No.· That was one of the problems.
`
`24· · · ·Q· · And what time period are we talking about?
`
`25· · · ·A· · The most recent filing, which --
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`·1· · · · · · (Simultaneous colloquy.)
`
`·2· · · · · · MR. WEINSTEIN:· I just want you to be careful
`
`·3· ·not to reveal any confidences that you might have had,
`
`·4· ·you know, with the university or a patent lawyer or
`
`·5· ·anything like that.· But just talk -- so talk generally,
`
`·6· ·because I don't think that's the subject of this
`
`·7· ·deposition.· You can continue.· Just be careful.
`
`·8· · · · · · THE WITNESS:· Thank you.
`
`·9· · · · · · The first attempts were when I was at Yale,
`
`10· ·which was now 16, 17 years ago.· And the first filing
`
`11· ·related to that would have been at least 25 years ago.
`
`12· · · · · · And then most recently, there's been one
`
`13· ·that -- I'm not exactly sure where it is in the process,
`
`14· ·but it is pending, I guess, you could say.· And that was
`
`15· ·from about six months ago.
`
`16· · · · · · MR. WEINSTEIN:· And, Dr. Kosten, since it was
`
`17· ·only six months ago, that's probably still confidential
`
`18· ·at the patent office.· So please don't go into any
`
`19· ·details regarding that.
`
`20· · · · · · THE WITNESS:· Thank you.
`
`21· ·BY MR. SHEAR:
`
`22· · · ·Q· · Over the course, Dr. Kosten, of your
`
`23· ·professional career, have you consulted for
`
`24· ·pharmaceutical companies?
`
`25· · · ·A· · Yes, I have.
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`THE SULLIVAN GROUP OF COURT REPORTERS
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`
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`·1· · · ·Q· · Which ones?
`
`·2· · · ·A· · If you can pardon for a second, I can give you
`
`·3· ·a pretty big list.
`
`·4· · · ·Q· · Okay.
`
`·5· · · ·A· · Okay, hold on a minute.· I'm now on my
`
`·6· ·computer.
`
`·7· · · · · · MR. WEINSTEIN:· Dr. Kosten --
`
`·8· · · · · · THE WITNESS:· Don't do that?
`
`·9· · · · · · MR. WEINSTEIN:· -- don't go to other documents
`
`10· ·that aren't in front of all of us.· You should just
`
`11· ·testify from --
`
`12· · · · · · THE WITNESS:· From my memory.· All right.
`
`13· · · · · · From my memory, I've consulted with Novartis,
`
`14· ·Pfizer, Alkermes, US WorldMeds, Opiant, Mallinckrodt,
`
`15· ·Neurocrine Sciences, Aptynix.
`
`16· · · · · · There are -- that's all I can remember off the
`
`17· ·top of my head.· There are 35 or 40, though.
`
`18· ·BY MR. SHEAR:
`
`19· · · ·Q· · At a very high level, Doctor -- I'm not looking
`
`20· ·for specifics on your consulting relationships with any
`
`21· ·of these companies.· But at a very high level, can you
`
`22· ·describe for me what -- what you were consulting on?
`
`23· · · ·A· · Mostly my consultations were related to
`
`24· ·substance use issues, antidepressants, and a little bit
`
`25· ·with antipsychotic agents, agents for treating
`
`THE SULLIVAN GROUP OF COURT REPORTERS
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`·1· ·posttraumatic stress disorder and related anxiety
`
`·2· ·disorders.
`
`·3· · · ·Q· · Okay.· Now, Doctor, if I look at your
`
`·4· ·background, you're -- I want to make sure I get this --
`
`·5· ·I get this right.· You are currently the -- the director
`
`·6· ·of addictive disorders and alcoholism; is that correct?
`
`·7· · · ·A· · That's correct, at Baylor College of Medicine.
`
`·8· · · ·Q· · And when I look at your CV -- and tell me if
`
`·9· ·you disagree:· When I look at your CV, I see an
`
`10· ·incredible amount of work in the area of substance use
`
`11· ·generally.· Is that fair?
`
`12· · · ·A· · Yes.· That is fair.
`
`13· · · ·Q· · So it's certainly fair to say that you are
`
`14· ·absolutely an expert in the areas of substance use;
`
`15· ·right?
`
`16· · · ·A· · Correct.
`
`17· · · ·Q· · Fair to say, Doctor, that you've done more work
`
`18· ·in the field of substance use than you have on
`
`19· ·antipsychotics?
`
`20· · · ·A· · Yes.
`
`21· · · ·Q· · And is it also fair to say that you've done
`
`22· ·more work in the field of substance use than you have on
`
`23· ·the issue of weight gain associated with antipsychotics?
`
`24· · · ·A· · Yes.
`
`25· · · ·Q· · And is it also fair to say that over the course
`
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`·1· ·of your career, the primary focus of your academic
`
`·2· ·interests or research has been in substance use and
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`·3· ·addiction?
`
`·4· · · ·A· · That's correct.
`
`·5· · · ·Q· · Doctor, you mentioned in your declaration --
`
`·6· ·and we can go to a specific paragraph if you need to.
`
`·7· ·But you mention in your declaration that you've treated
`
`·8· ·hundreds of patients with antipsychotics.
`
`·9· · · · · · Do you recall that?
`
`10· · · ·A· · Yes.
`
`11· · · ·Q· · And let me just ask you:· Are you still seeing
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`12· ·patients today?
`
`13· · · ·A· · Yes.· Well, Mondays are my days I see patients.
`
`14· · · ·Q· · Sure.· I just meant generally speaking as part
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`15· ·of your current employment, are you seeing patients?
`
`16· · · ·A· · Yes.
`
`17· · · ·Q· · And did you -- you're obviously a psychiatrist;
`
`18· ·correct?
`
`19· · · ·A· · Correct.
`
`20· · · ·Q· · And you began -- just to put some -- some time
`
`21· ·frame here, I know that you graduated medical school in
`
`22· ·1977.· When did you sort of accomplish the steps that
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`23· ·you needed to accomplish to become a licensed
`
`24· ·psychiatrist?
`
`25· · · ·A· · At that point, I was licensed in the state of
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`·1· ·Connecticut.· I had completed my psychiatric education,
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`·2· ·so I was at that point considered board eligible.
`
`·3· · · · · · I then later took the board examinations.· And
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`·4· ·I believe -- I don't remember if it was 1981 or -- I'd
`
`·5· ·have to look at my CV to know exactly what date they
`
`·6· ·issued that board certification in psychiatry and
`
`·7· ·neurology.
`
`·8· · · ·Q· · And that's totally fair.· I don't -- I'm not
`
`·9· ·looking for precision right now.· I'm just trying to get
`
`10· ·the order of magnitude here.
`
`11· · · · · · So it's essentially 40 years that you've been a
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`12· ·practicing psychiatrist; is that right?
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`13· · · ·A· · That's correct.
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`14· · · ·Q· · And over the course of that 40-year car
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