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`UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT
`CENTRAL DISTRICT OF CALIFORNIA
`SOUTHERN DIVISION - SANTA ANA
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`Plaintiff,
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`Defendant.
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` ) CASE NO: 8:19-CV-01805-DOC-JDE
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` )
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`CIVIL
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` ) Santa Ana, California
` )
` ) Monday, March 16, 2020
` ) (9:10 a.m. to 9:57 a.m.)
` ) (5:07 p.m. to 5:36 p.m.)
` (5:51 p.m. to 6:23 p.m.)
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`PINN, INC,
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`vs.
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`APPLE, INC,
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`MOTION TO CONSOLIDATE AND SCHEDULING CONFERENCE
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`BEFORE THE HONORABLE DAVID O. CARTER,
`UNITED STATES DISTRICT JUDGE
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`
`SEE PAGE 2
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`Recorded; CourtSmart
`Kelly Davis
`Exceptional Reporting Services, Inc.
`P.O. Box 8365
`Corpus Christi, TX 78468
`361 949-2988
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`APPEARANCES:
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`Court Reporter:
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`Courtroom Deputy:
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`Transcribed by:
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`Proceedings recorded by electronic sound recording;
`transcript produced by transcription service.
`EXCEPTIONAL REPORTING SERVICES, INC
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`APPEARANCES FOR:
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`Plaintiff:
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`Defendant:
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`RYAN E. HATCH, ESQ.
`Law Office of Ryan E. Hatch, PC
`13323 Washington Blvd., Suite 100
`Los Angeles, CA 90066
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`DAVID A. SKEELS, ESQ.
`Whitaker Chalk Swindle & Schwartz
`301 Commerce St., Suite 3500
`Fort Worth, TX 76102
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`CHRISTOPHER S. MARCHESE, ESQ.
`Fish & Richardson, PC
`633 West 5th Street, 26th Floor
`Los Angeles, CA 90071
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`SETH M. SPROUL, ESQ.
`Fish & Richardson, PC
`12390 El Camino Real
`San Diego, CA 92130
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`RYAN M. NISHIMOTO, ESQ.
`Arnold & Porter Kaye Scholer
`777 S. Figueroa St., 44th Floor
`Los Angeles, CA 90014
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`JEFFREY M. BARRON, ESQ.
`TODD G. VARE, ESQ.
`Barnes & Thornburg
`11 S. Meridian St.
`Indianapolis, IN 46204
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`SETH A. GOLD, ESQ.
`Barnes & Thornburg
`2029 Century Park East, Suite 300
`Los Angeles, CA 90067
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`Santa Ana, California; Monday, March 16, 2020; 9:10 a.m.
`(Call to order)
`THE COURT: First of all, if you'd be kind enough to
`make your appearances. I know who you are but just for our
`record. Let me start with the Plaintiff for just a moment.
`MR. SKEELS: David Skeels on behalf of Plaintiff,
`your Honor.
`THE COURT: All right, now let's go slowly. You
`represent Pinn of course. And you're David Skeels from Texas.
`MR. SKEELS: Yes, sir.
`THE COURT: Pleasure. And your hands are in your
`pocket and you can take them out of your pocket now. And,
`counsel, you should be -- is it Cabrach Connor?
`MR. HATCH: No, I'm Ryan Hatch, local counsel.
`THE COURT: Well where's Cabrach Connor? I don't
`know who you are. You're not on my list.
`MR. SKEELS: Ryan Hatch is our local counsel.
`THE COURT: Okay.
`MR. SKEELS: And when we were here --
`THE COURT: Here, Tony, give this to counsel. I must
`have missed your last time.
`MR. HATCH: I've been here.
`THE COURT: So it's my fault. So I'm going to turn
`to -- yeah, no, that's not what I'm looking at, though. I'm
`looking at this. All the underline is mine -- and would you
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`THE COURT: Just one.
`MR. SKEELS: -- one was here --
`THE COURT: Yeah, one. You're okay. I just want to
`make sure is we start flip-flopping around.
`MR. SKEELS: Yes, your Honor.
`THE COURT: Okay.
`MR. SKEELS: I've been identified on all the
`pleadings as lead counsel --
`THE COURT: Okay.
`MR. HATCH: And we --
`THE COURT: And then, sir, I apologize to you because
`I remember you but I don't remember your name. So once again,
`my apologies.
`MR. HATCH: Ryan Hatch, your Honor.
`THE COURT: Ryan Hatch, okay.
`MR. HATCH: Yes.
`THE COURT: Thank you very much. And is it R-Y-A-N?
`MR. HATCH: Yes, your Honor.
`THE COURT: Thank you so much.
`MR. SKEELS: And our client, Mr. Sean Kim, is here in
`the courtroom with us today as well, your Honor.
`THE COURT: Okay. And where is that gentleman
`located? Oh, thank you very much, sir. It's a pleasure to
`meet you.
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`Then for Apple I should have Christopher is it
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`Marchese?
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`MR. MARCHESE: Marchese, your --
`THE COURT: Marchese, I apologize --
`MR. MARCHESE: That's fine, your Honor.
`THE COURT: -- for the mispronouncing (indisc.) it's
`nice to see you.
`MR. MARCHESE: Nice to see you, too.
`THE COURT: And Seth Sproul, and you're from San
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`Diego?
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`MR. SPROUL: Good morning, your Honor.
`THE COURT: San Diego?
`MR. SPROUL: Yes, that's right, your Honor.
`THE COURT: Okay, thank you. It's nice to have you
`here. And then I do have a -- and is -- are there any other
`counsel who you think might be making an appearance now or in
`the future on this case?
`MR. MARCHESE: Your Honor, we may have on occasion
`another, a lawyer at Fish and Richardson --
`THE COURT: Who?
`MR. MARCHESE: -- named Tucker Terhufen.
`THE COURT: And where is that person located?
`MR. MARCHESE: He's in San Diego, and he may be
`appearing later in the case.
`THE COURT: Well, --
`MR. MARCHESE: He's on the pleadings currently.
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`THE COURT: Yeah, I know. But why, what's he going
`to be doing?
`MR. MARCHESE: He will be potentially dealing with
`Markman issues and/or other issues down the line, even maybe
`taking witnesses at trial, if we ever get there.
`THE COURT: Oh, we're getting there. You're the most
`interesting case on my calendar so you're not going to settle
`it, okay? Could be fabulous. Okay, so then -- and I want to
`thank you for your courtesy. And once again I apologize for
`having you here today. So on behalf of Google, I should have
`four folks here, Seth Gold.
`MR. GOLD: That's me, your Honor.
`THE COURT: And you're in Los Angeles then.
`MR. GOLD: Yes, your Honor.
`THE COURT: Okay. And I've got Roya Rathanampouri
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`(sic).
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`MR. GOLD: She's not with -- she's not part of our
`group here today but she has appeared on the case and --
`THE COURT: She was here last time, wasn't she? Or
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`was she?
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`MR. GOLD: She was not with us.
`THE COURT: What's she going to be doing on the case?
`MR. GOLD: She's an associate on the case. She's --
`THE COURT: I know that. What's --
`MR. GOLD: -- in Los Angeles --
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`right from day one. There's not going to be any equivocation
`about that. That special master will fly over, that way I'll
`know that that takes place in a timely fashion and I'm not
`wasting your time. Okay.
`MR. NISHIMOTO: We would propose Judge --
`THE COURT: So come up with a name. You don't have
`to do that today. I'm not going to hold you just for a special
`master. But when these depositions take place, I hope they're
`in a cluster of time to save us money and I hope you have to
`make one trip. Okay.
`MR. NISHIMOTO: Thank you.
`THE COURT: Okay, so I'll have a special master.
`I'll keep you in claims, okay?
`MR. KEYZER: Yes, sir.
`THE COURT: Just in case, okay. Forget the trial
`estimates right now. If it's one trial, which I pretty certain
`will take place because you're going to need more time. In
`other words this four days or seven days, it doesn't make sense
`right now. Let's see what's left after the claim construction
`and our dispositive motions and then I'll negotiate with you
`and get you plenty of time; because remember I'm going to have
`to send out a jury summons which will be expansive. Once we
`get over five days or over ten days, we have to send out an
`awful lot of jury summons. It could be well over 2,000 to get
`people to sit. And I know you don't believe that but trust me,
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`it's quite a process to get folks to serve anywhere over ten
`days right now; almost impossible, frankly. And especially
`after what's I think is about to occur.
`Okay, I want to have a private conference with the --
`with David for just a moment about the scheduling before I come
`out and make a statement, because I could be wrong so I want to
`listen to your wisdom for a moment privately. So we'll be
`right back with you, okay?
`(Recess taken from 5:36 p.m. to 5:51 p.m.)
`
`THE COURT: David's informed me that on the 491, you
`have six terms at the present time; three of those could be
`grouped together so really there's four groupings. One term
`seems to be unique to the 491 but the same terms are in the 491
`in the 066 and they're congruent. There are ten items, I think
`you said the three can be grouped together, so there's eight.
`MR. KEYZER: Yes, sir.
`THE COURT: So there seems to be nine unique disputes
`so far. We're going to leave the 192, my memory's correct,
`alone for the present time because supposed to issue on March
`31st and it's a little premature to start second-guessing that.
`Let me say this, although don't spread this around.
`Although I don't sound like it, I really care about my counsel
`here, I really care about your personal lives. And we're going
`to propose some dates, but if you've got children, an
`anniversary, a vacation, I truly want you to keep those,
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`understood? So we'll toss out a date. I don't care about your
`other clients, though. Don't tell me you have another
`appearance in another court. Just fly out and you'll see me at
`6:00 o'clock in the evening, okay? So but if you have
`something personal, I don't want you to give that up (indisc.)
`family, fair enough? So we think that we want a claim
`construction sometime in early June. David's prepared to issue
`an R and R to me sometime in July which would give you a time
`to push back with your input concerning that R and R to the
`Court. We'd like to have our dispositive motions on -- in
`November. I originally had them for November 23rd but I'm
`concerned that that might be Thanksgiving week, and if that is,
`I've made a terrible mistake and I'd like to move that forward
`a week, okay? Our pretrial, we'd like to have that on January
`11th of 2021, and we're hoping you go to trial on January 26th
`of 2021. We're concerned about the overseas witnesses. And
`the weakness in this discussion is I don't have a discovery
`referee present today. And David would choose to be my help in
`terms of claim construction at the present time and is a little
`uncomfortable being involved. I really don't care if you can
`conduct an overseas video. In other words, if all of you agree
`to that, that's fine. But if you're going overseas, I'm going
`to insist upon a discovery master being with you. If you can
`conduct that by video, that's fine, but I'll leave that to you.
`But that discovery master will be with you. And I don't want
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`MR. KEYZER: I'm not sure, your Honor.
`THE COURT: Do you want to set it on Tuesday again?
`MR. KEYZER: Makes sense to me.
`THE COURT: Yeah, let's -- counsel, let's move that
`to a Tuesday again. I'm just not sure how long the dispositive
`motions will take. So out of courtesy to you, let's set that
`on a -- on the 17th; would that work for you?
`MR. SPEAKER: November 17th?
`THE COURT: Yeah.
`MR. MARCHESE: It works for Apple.
`THE COURT: Pinn, does that work?
`MR. SKEELS: Let me double check? Yes, your Honor,
`that's fine.
`THE COURT: Google and Samsung, does that work for
`
`you?
`
`MR. NISHIMOTO: For Samsung, yes.
`MR. VARE: Yes, your Honor, for --
`THE COURT: Google, okay.
`MR. VARE: -- Google, yes.
`MR. KEYZER: What time on the 17th, your Honor?
`THE COURT: Seven thirty.
`MR. KEYZER: Seven thirty.
`THE COURT: Yeah. Now, I never know if I'm in a
`criminal matter but you can wait half an hour if I am, okay?
`Those criminal matters pop in and out of our calendar. So
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`7:30. I'll leave the pretrial clear out to January the 11th so
`I won't catch them in between on that Thanksgiving day,
`Christmas, you know, holiday, okay? So the pretrial will be
`January 11th, 2021, and our jury trial will be January 26th,
`2021. Right now, this is a consolidated trial but I'm going to
`be listen very quickly or very attentively to any functional
`issues that you have.
`One thing that we were discussing was the protective
`order, and we're a little concerned about the Defendants in a
`deposition where you're forced into a position of sharing
`unique information. But we think outside counsel can handle
`that but we're looking for some guidance. We can cause
`separate depositions if we want to if you're concerned, but
`outside counsel's eyes only might be a way to go. But I'm
`subject to listening to what your needs are because that's
`unique information amongst competitors. Although you may be
`aside, I'm a little concerned that Google's disclosing to
`Samsung or whatever. So help me with that so that your clients
`aren't concerned.
`MR. MARCHESE: Your Honor, Chris Marchese for Apple.
`We think we have that covered in the protective order which if
`it's not filed will be filed any minute.
`THE COURT: I haven't seen that.
`MR. MARCHESE: Consolidated.
`THE COURT: I haven't seen that so I -- okay.
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`7:30. I'll leave the pretrial clear out to January the 11th so
`I won't catch them in between on that Thanksgiving day,
`Christmas, you know, holiday, okay? So the pretrial will be
`January 11th, 2021, and our jury trial will be January 26th,
`2021. Right now, this is a consolidated trial but I'm going to
`be listen very quickly or very attentively to any functional
`issues that you have.
`One thing that we were discussing was the protective
`order, and we're a little concerned about the Defendants in a
`deposition where you're forced into a position of sharing
`unique information. But we think outside counsel can handle
`that but we're looking for some guidance. We can cause
`separate depositions if we want to if you're concerned, but
`outside counsel's eyes only might be a way to go. But I'm
`subject to listening to what your needs are because that's
`unique information amongst competitors. Although you may be
`aside, I'm a little concerned that Google's disclosing to
`Samsung or whatever. So help me with that so that your clients
`aren't concerned.
`MR. MARCHESE: Your Honor, Chris Marchese for Apple.
`We think we have that covered in the protective order which if
`it's not filed will be filed any minute.
`THE COURT: I haven't seen that.
`MR. MARCHESE: Consolidated.
`THE COURT: I haven't seen that so I -- okay.
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`MR. KEYZER: Would you like for me to be present at
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`trial?
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`THE COURT: I don't know yet. I don't know that I'm
`going to need David present at trial. I don't think so. I
`doubt it. I've never -- I've had more of these that have
`actually gone to trial than anybody else in this courthouse,
`believe it or not, except maybe Tevrizian. And I don't think I
`can ever remember having you on the scene because my claim
`construction was done by dispositive motions (indisc.) then we
`get into the mish-mash of the Federal Circuit trying to
`interpret the evidence code, which is interesting. You'll find
`it conflicting, by the way, when you actually get into trial.
`Look at the Federal Circuit's evidentiary rules. It gets very,
`very interesting in terms of whether they're congruent or not.
`Okay, so anyway go about your business, and thank you very much
`for your courtesy to day.
`(This proceeding was adjourned at 6:23 p.m.)
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`CERTIFICATION
`
` I
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` certify that the foregoing is a correct transcript from the
`electronic sound recording of the proceedings in the above-
`entitled matter.
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` Signed
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`April 29, 2020
` Dated
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`TONI HUDSON, TRANSCRIBER
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`EXCEPTIONAL REPORTING SERVICES, INC
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`PINN-2003
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