`
`Transcript of David Rosenblum,
`Ph.D.
`
`Date: February 7, 2023
`Case: Netflix, Inc. -v- CA, Inc. (PTAB)
`
`Planet Depos
`Phone: 888-433-3767
`Fax: 888-503-3767
`Email: transcripts@planetdepos.com
`www.planetdepos.com
`
`WORLDWIDE COURT REPORTING & LITIGATION TECHNOLOGY
`
`IPR2022-00322 (Netflix, Inc. v. CA, Inc.)
`Netflix, Inc. - Ex. 1031, Page 000001
`
`

`

`Transcript of David Rosenblum, Ph.D.
`February 7, 2023
`
`1 (1 to 4)
`
`1
`
`3
`
` I N D E X
`
`WITNESS: PAGE:
`
`DAVID ROSENBLUM, Ph.D.
`
`EXAMINATION BY:
`
`Mr. Ponder 5
`
` E X H I B I T S
`
` (NOT ATTACHED)
`
`Exhibit 1001 10
`
`Exhibit 1002 15
`
`0
`
`Exhibit 1019 19
`
`1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 1
`
` IN THE UNITED STATES PATENT AND TRADEMARK OFFICE
`
` BEFORE THE PATENT TRIAL AND APPEAL BOARD
`
` NETFLIX, INC.,
`
` Petitioner,
`
` v.
`
` CA, INC.,
`
` Patent Owner.
`
` IPR2022-00322
`
` U.S. Patent No. 8,656,419
`
`0
`
`
`
`1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 1
`
`11
`
` Deposition of David Rosenblum, Ph.D.
`
`11
`
`Exhibit 1020 20
`
`12
`
` Tuesday, February 7, 2023
`
`12
`
`Exhibit 1021 22
`
`13
`
` 7:02 a.m., Pacific Time
`
`13
`
`Exhibit 1022 22
`
`14
`
` (ALL PARTIES ATTENDED REMOTELY)
`
`14
`
`Exhibit 1023 22
`
`15
`
`
`
`16
`
`Job No.: 477027
`
`15
`
`Exhibit 1024 22
`
`16
`
`Exhibit 2004 171
`
`17
`
`17
`
`Pages: 1 - 217
`
`18
`
`Reported By: Stephanie A. Battaglia, CSR, RMR,
`
`19
`
`CRR
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`
`
`
`
`
`
`
`
`
`
`
`
`
`
`
`
`
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`2
`
`4
`
` MS. REPORTER: Here begins the
`videoconference deposition of David Rosenblum,
`Ph.D., in the matter of Netflix versus CA, Inc.
` Today's date is February 7, 2023, and the
`time is 7:02 a.m., Pacific Time.
` My name is Stephanie Battaglia of
`Planet Depos.
` Beginning with the noticing party, will
`counsel please introduce themselves, state whom
`they represent, and stipulate to the swearing in
`0
`of the witness remotely.
`11
` Mr. Ponder?
`12
` MR. PONDER: Chris Ponder with Sheppard,
`13
`Mullin, Richter & Hampton for Petitioner Netflix,
`14
`Inc., and we stipulate to the administration of
`15
`the remote oath.
`16
` MS. REPORTER: Mr. Young?
`17
` MR. YOUNG: Dan Young from Adsero IP
`18
`representing Patent Owner CA, Inc., and we
`19
`stipulate to the remote swearing in of the witness
`20
`as well.
`21
` (Witness sworn.)
`22
`PLANET DEPOS
`888.433.3767 | WWW.PLANETDEPOS.COM
`
`1234567891
`
`PRESENT:
`
` SHEPPARD, MULLINS, RICHTER & HAMPTON, LLP
` BY: MR. CHRIS PONDER
` 1540 El Camino Real, Suite 120
` Menlo Park, California 94025
` (650) 815-2600
` e-mail: cponder@sheppardmullin.com
`
` appeared on behalf of the
` Petitioner Netflix, Inc.;
`
` ADSERO IP, LLC,
` d/b/a SWANSON & BRATSCHUN
` BY: MR. DANIEL S. YOUNG
` 8120 Southpark Terrace
` Littleton, Colorado 80120
` (303) 268-0066
` e-mail: dyoung@adseroip.com
` dyoung@sbiplaw.com
`
` appeared on behalf of the Patent
` Owner CA, Inc.;
`
`ALSO PRESENT:
`
` Mr. John Gugarty, Technician
` Planet Depos
`
` Ms. Stephanie A. Battaglia, CSR, RMR, CRR
` Planet Depos
`
`
`
`
`
`
`
`
`
`
`
`
`
`1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 1
`
`0
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`Netflix, Inc. - Ex. 1031, Page 000002
`
`

`

`7
`
`8
`
`Transcript of David Rosenblum, Ph.D.
`February 7, 2023
`5
`
`2 (5 to 8)
`
`take a break until after you had finished
`answering a pending question, does that work for
`you?
` A Yes, that's fine.
` Q Do you understand that you are not allowed
`to discuss the substance of your testimony during
`any breaks in the proceeding until your deposition
`is concluded?
` A Yes, I understand that.
` Q Although I will try to ask questions that
`are easy to understand or at least comprehendible,
`I am sure I will fail at some point, will you
`please let me know if you have trouble
`understanding a question or would like to have it
`rephrased?
` A Yes, I can do that.
` Q During the deposition if I ask a question
`you are required to provide a response unless your
`attorney instructs you not to answer. Your
`attorney may also object before you answer a
`question, but unless he instructs you not to
`answer do you understand that you should provide
`
`1234567891
`
`0
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`
` DAVID ROSENBLUM, Ph.D.,
`called as a witness herein, having been first duly
`sworn was examined and testified via Zoom
`conference as follows:
` EXAMINATION
` BY MR. PONDER:
` Q Good morning, Dr. Rosenblum.
` A Good morning.
` Q Have you been deposed before?
` A Yes, I have.
` Q How many times have you been a witness in
`a deposition?
` A I believe it's been three times, and all
`three times with colleagues of yours.
` Q By colleagues of mine, are you referring
`to other proceedings involving Netflix and Avago
`or CA?
` A Yes. I was deposed I believe twice by
`Mr. Liang and once by Mr. Defosse.
` Q Have you ever given any testimony at any
`trial or other proceeding?
` A No, I haven't.
`
`1234567891
`
`0
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`
`1234567891
`
`0
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`
`6
`
`an answer?
` Q Before we get started I would like to go
` A Yes, I understand that.
`over some of the ground rules for deposition.
` A Okay.
` Q Are you on any medication or any other
`substance today that prevents you from providing
` Q Do you understand that you have sworn an
`accurate and truthful testimony?
`oath to tell the truth, the whole truth, and the
` A No, I am not.
`complete truth?
` A Yes, I understand that.
` Q Do you have any documents in electronic or
`paper form with you today?
` Q We have a court reporter here today, and
` A So I have a binder of paper copies of
`although we are on video the record is going to be
`several documents. Those are clean copies with no
`prepared in the format of a typewritten
`0
`notes written on them. I also could access PDF
`transcript, do you understand that?
`11
`copies of any of the exhibits in the case if need
` A Yes.
`12
`be on my computer here.
` Q And so for the benefit of the court
`13
` Q Can you please tell me what you have in
`reporter and so that the record is clear it is
`14
`clean copies in the binder?
`very important that we have verbal responses that
`15
` A Yes.
`can be recorded as opposed to head nods and other
`16
` So I have a copy of the petition.
`ways that in person we can indicate an answer.
`17
` i have a copy of the Patent Owner's
`Does that make sense to you?
`18
`response.
` A Yes, that does.
`19
` I have a copy of the institution decision.
` Q We can take a break whenever you need a
`20
` I have a copy of my own declaration.
`break, just be sure to ask for one. The only
`21
` I have a copy of the declaration of
`request is that if you request a break that we not
`22
`PLANET DEPOS
`888.433.3767 | WWW.PLANETDEPOS.COM
`
`1234567891
`
`Netflix, Inc. - Ex. 1031, Page 000003
`
`

`

`3 (9 to 12)
`
`11
`
`Transcript of David Rosenblum, Ph.D.
`February 7, 2023
`9
`
`1234567891
`
`0
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`
`Dr. Jagadish.
` i have a copy of the transcript of
`Dr. Jagadish's deposition.
` I have a copy of the '419 patent, the
`Medeiros patent, and I have a copy of the Verbeke
`patent.
` And I also have a print-out of the
`certificate of correction for the '419 patent.
` Q One last thing is since we are taking this
`by computer and you have access to your computer,
`would you please not access things on your
`computer or any other electronic device unless I
`have asked you to do so?
` A Yes, that's fine.
` I have all of my applications closed on
`the computer and my phone is set aside.
` Q Do you understand that you are here today
`to give testimony in connection with the U.S.
`Patent 8,656,419 to Medeiros?
` A Yes, I understand that.
` Q And if I refer to that patent as the '419
`patent, will you understand that I am referring to
`
`the disclosures of the '419 patent?
` A Yes, I feel I do.
` Q When were you first retained in connection
`with this IPR proceeding?
` A I believe it was in the early part of last
`year in the spring, maybe around April or May.
` Q Are you receiving financial compensation
`for your work in this matter?
` A Yes, I am.
` Q What rate are you charging for your
`services in this matter?
` A I have been charging $500 per hour.
` Q And how much have you billed the
`Patent Owner this far in the matter?
` A Several dozen hours, certainly four or
`five dozen hours roughly. Again, I don't have a
`clear sense of exactly how many hours.
` Q Have you discussed this proceeding with
`anyone other than Mr. Young?
` A No, I haven't. Well, yes, I have, with
`Chad King, Mr. King.
` Q Other than Mr. King and Mr. Young have you
`12
`
`1234567891
`
`10
`
`spoken to anybody else?
`that patent?
` A No, I haven't.
` A Yes, I will.
` Q What do you consider to be your area of
` (Document identified as Exhibit 1001 for
`expertise?
` identification.)
` A My area of expertise is software
`BY MR. PONDER:
`engineering, distributed systems, mobile
` Q If you could take a look at your
`computing, and more recently machine learning.
`Exhibit 1001, the '419 patent.
` A I think I have that in front of me.
` Q How long have you been working in the area
`of distributed systems?
` Q How much time would you say you have spent
` A Just about 40 years. My Ph.D.
`reviewing the '419 patent?
`0
`dissertation was in the area of distributed
` A Wow, it's hard to say. Part of the
`11
`systems and I started my Ph.D. 40 years ago this
`difficulty relates to what constitutes reviewing
`12
`coming August.
`the patent.
`13
` Reviewing the petition and looking at the
` Q I'd like to ask you a few questions about
`14
`citations to the patent, does that count?
`your declaration. Feel free to refer to it.
`15
` A Okay.
` I'd say in general it's certainly several
`16
`hours, one to two dozen hours I think is a
` Q Is Exhibit 2004 a true and accurate copy
`17
`reasonable estimate.
`of your declaration submitted in this matter?
`18
` A Yes, it is.
` Q One to two dozen hours is what you said?
`19
` A Yes. That's just a very rough guess
` Q Did you review your declaration in
`20
`though.
`preparation for your deposition today?
`21
` A Yes, I did.
` Q And do you feel like you fully understand
`22
`PLANET DEPOS
`888.433.3767 | WWW.PLANETDEPOS.COM
`
`1234567891
`
`0
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`
`1234567891
`
`0
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`
`Netflix, Inc. - Ex. 1031, Page 000004
`
`

`

`Transcript of David Rosenblum, Ph.D.
`February 7, 2023
`13
`
`4 (13 to 16)
`
`15
`preliminary opinions of my own about some of the
`arguments in the petition and the kinds of things
`that could be presented in the preliminary Patent
`Owner response.
` Q I want to ask you some questions about the
`materials you have considered in this proceeding,
`and if you turn to Page 134 of your declaration I
`believe the list of materials considered is
`listed.
` A Okay, I will bring that up.
` Okay, yes, I have got that list in front
`of me.
` Q Do you believe this list correctly
`reflects all materials that you reviewed and
`considered in preparing your declaration?
` A Yes, I believe it does.
` (Document identified as Exhibit 1002 for
` identification.)
`BY MR. PONDER:
` Q Did you review the prosecution histories
`of the '419 patent, I believe it is 1002.
` A I looked through the prosecution history.
`
`1234567891
`
`0
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`
` Q Did you find any errors in your
`declaration that you wish to correct?
` A No.
` Q Does your declaration contain a complete
`statement of your opinions in this matter?
` A Yes, it does.
` Q Have your opinions in connection with this
`IPR changed since the time you executed your
`declaration?
` A No, they haven't.
` Q When did you begin working on your
`declaration?
` A Again, I would have to think back. It
`must have been around September or October if I
`remember correctly.
` Q And how did you go about preparing your
`declaration?
` A The preparation started with discussions
`with Adsero counsel with Mr. Young and Mr. King.
`We discussed the petition, discussed the
`preliminary Patent Owner response, and formulated
`an understanding of what the contentions were with
`14
`
`16
`There were -- I confined my attention primarily to
`regards to the invalidity of the claims in the
`the substantive arguments between the inventors
`'419 patent and eventually recorded what I was
`and the patent examiner, and then of course
`willing to agree to as my opinion about the matter
`familiarized myself with the certificate of
`in the form of the declaration.
`correction.
` Q Did you prepare the first draft of the
` A lot of the more administrative kinds of
`declaration?
`documents I didn't really bother to review that
` A I did not do the writing of the first
`carefully.
`draft of the declaration, no.
` Q How much time would you say you spent
` Q Who did the first writing of the
`reviewing the prosecution history?
`0
`declaration?
` A Again, it's very hard to say, probably
`11
` A I believe it was Mr. King and Mr. Young.
`spent at least three or four hours, if not more, a
`12
` Q When did you first see the Patent Owner
`half dozen hours maybe.
`13
`response?
` Q Do you have experience reviewing records
`14
` A The Patent Owner response, that would have
`from the Patent Office?
`15
`been after the submission of my declaration.
` A What kind of records might you be thinking
`16
` Q When did you see the Patent Owner
`about? I mean, I have experience as an inventor
`17
`preliminary response?
`preparing a patent application, preparing
`18
` A The Patent Owner preliminary response, so
`responses to the Patent Office when things have
`19
`when I was first engaged back in the spring of
`been challenged in a patent application trying to
`20
`last year, at that time Mr. Young and Mr. King
`get toward the award of a patent, that sort of
`21
`were already starting to think about the
`thing. Is that the kind of thing you were
`22
`preliminary Patent Owner response and I gave some
`PLANET DEPOS
`888.433.3767 | WWW.PLANETDEPOS.COM
`
`1234567891
`
`1234567891
`
`0
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`
`1234567891
`
`0
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`
`Netflix, Inc. - Ex. 1031, Page 000005
`
`

`

`Transcript of David Rosenblum, Ph.D.
`February 7, 2023
`17
`
`1234567891
`
`0
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`
`thinking about?
` Q Let me try to ask a different way.
` How did you decide whether something was
`substantive and you would review it versus I
`believe you used the term administrative -- some
`materials being administrative that you didn't
`review?
` A Some of that was under the guidance of
`Mr. Young and Mr. King who were of course very
`experienced in reading through a prosecution
`history.
` Part of it I would say also is
`commonsense.
` I mean, if there is a document that's
`primarily recording dates and times and recording
`a deadline for a response from the inventors, for
`example, I would consider that to be an
`administrative document.
` But if there is a document where the
`patent examiner is stating something about
`obviousness or non-novelty and then the inventors
`are providing a response to that, to me that's
`
`5 (17 to 20)
`
`19
`
`patent, how it potentially does or does not
`anticipate the '419 patent.
` Q About how many hours did you spend
`reviewing the Jalan reference?
` A The Jalan reference I did not review very
`much, maybe a couple hours, two or three hours
`roughly.
` Q How much time did you spend reviewing the
`Nieman reference?
` A It would be the same, roughly two to
`three hours.
` Q Are you aware that the Patent Owner has
`sued Netflix for infringing the '419 patent?
` A Yes, I'm aware of that, and I believe part
`of my declaration mentions that as well.
` Q Have you reviewed any materials from the
`related District Court case against Netflix?
` A The only materials I have reviewed are
`those that were cited as exhibits in the petition
`or Dr. Jagadish's declaration.
` (Document identified as Exhibit 1019 for
` identification.)
`
`20
`
`part of the substantive consideration of the
` (Document identified as Exhibit 1020 for
`substance of the patent.
` identification.)
` Q How much time have you spent reviewing the
` Q Do you believe that to be Exhibit 1019 and
`petition?
`1020?
` A The petition? Again, several hours I
` A Yes, I believe that's correct.
`would say. As you might imagine, I mean, it is
` (Document identified as Exhibit 1029 for
`quite a blur by now having worked on this case for
` identification.)
`probably at least nine months or so, having gone
`BY MR. PONDER:
`back and forth between two dozen exhibits or so
` Q Do you recall reviewing the claim
`and trying to develop an understanding, put the
`construction order that has been filed in this
`0
`pieces together and that sort of thing.
`proceeding as Exhibit 1029?
`11
` A Yes.
` Q How much time do you believe you spent
`12
` That was, if I remember correctly, that
`reviewing Dr. Jagadish's declaration?
`13
` A Again, several hours. Probably close to a
`was one of the documents that was cited by Dr.
`14
`half dozen hours, I would say. It's a very long
`Jagadish and so I had a look at that document to
`15
`declaration.
`understand what it was that Dr. Jagadish was
`16
` My memory is that it's roughly twice as
`citing.
`17
`long as my own.
` Q Do you see Exhibit 1029 of your list of
`18
` Q About how much time did you spend
`materials considered?
`19
` A No, I don't.
`reviewing the Verbeke reference?
`20
` A Again, several hours to develop an
` Q Just to make sure, let me share with you a
`21
`understanding of that, how it relates to the '419
`copy of Exhibit 1029. Do you see -- sorry, do you
`22
`PLANET DEPOS
`888.433.3767 | WWW.PLANETDEPOS.COM
`
`1234567891
`
`18
`
`1234567891
`
`0
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`
`1234567891
`
`0
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`
`Netflix, Inc. - Ex. 1031, Page 000006
`
`

`

`Transcript of David Rosenblum, Ph.D.
`February 7, 2023
`21
`
`6 (21 to 24)
`
`23
`
` To be honest, I don't even remember if I
`even cited those specific exhibits in my
`declaration.
` Q Did you review the complaint accusing
`Netflix of infringement?
` A I believe so. That's not one of these
`documents here if I understand correctly.
` 1019, for example, is an exhibit that
`accompanies some other document, but the exhibit
`is the only thing that I reviewed.
` Q How much time did you spend reviewing
`Exhibits 1019 and 1020?
` A Probably two to three hours I would say,
`again, primarily to try to understand why
`Dr. Jagadish was citing those exhibits.
` Q Did those exhibits contribute to the
`opinions you formed in this matter?
` A No, they didn't.
` Q In determining the scope of the challenged
`claims did you consider the position the Patent
`Owner asserted in the '419 patent against Netflix?
` A No, I didn't.
`
`1234567891
`
`0
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`
`see Exhibit 1029 on the screen?
` A Yes. I see the first page of a memorandum
`opinion and order, and I see at the bottom that
`the -- in the footer there that it is marked as
`Exhibit 1029.
` Q Looking at this document on the screen
`does this confirm for you that you did in fact
`review Exhibit 1029?
` A To some extent. I can see from your PDF
`reader that it's a 60-page document and I don't --
`to be honest I don't remember reading the full 60
`pages. I believe what I read were the portions
`that were cited by Dr. Jagadish.
` Q You believe your materials considered just
`submitted Exhibit 1029 by accident or is that you
`depended upon whether Dr. Jagadish cited 1029?
` A I guess that what I would say is that
`Exhibit 1029 contributed nothing to the opinions
`expressed in my declaration. I mean, there were
`additional exhibits that were cited in the
`petition as well and I had a look at them just to
`be able to say that, yes, I understood what was
`22
`
`24
`
`1234567891
`
` Q Do you know whether your opinions are
`consistent with the positions the Patent Owner has
`taken in the infringement litigation against
`Netflix?
` A I have no idea if they are.
` Q Did you review any of the expert reports
`in the district litigation?
` A No, I didn't.
` Q Did you consider any of the claim
`construction disclosures or claim construction
`0
`briefs from the District Court?
`11
` A Only to the extent that they were cited by
`12
`Dr. Jagadish or in the petition.
`13
` Q Looking at your list of materials
`14
`considered do you see any documents that appear to
`15
`be claim construction disclosures or you
`16
`understand to be claim construction disclosures?
`17
` A I remember reading a discussion of the
`18
`claim construction that was being proposed by the
`19
`Netflix side of the case was that -- I don't
`20
`remember exactly where I saw that, perhaps that
`21
`was part of Exhibit 1020.
`22
`PLANET DEPOS
`888.433.3767 | WWW.PLANETDEPOS.COM
`
`being cited and looked at.
` (Document identified as Exhibit 1021 for
` identification.)
` (Document identified as Exhibit 1022 for
` identification.)
` (Document identified as Exhibit 1023 for
` identification.)
` (Document identified as Exhibit 1024 for
` identification.)
`BY MR. PONDER:
` Q Did you review the dictionary definitions,
`they are Exhibits 1021, 1022, 1023, and 1024 on
`your list of materials considered?
` A Yes, I did.
` Q Did they contribute to your opinions in
`this matter?
` A Only to the extent that they seemed like
`reasonable definitions of what a procedure is or
`what related kinds of terms are like function or
`subroutine. I believe all four of those
`dictionary definitions were substantively similar
`to each other.
`
`1234567891
`
`0
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`
`1234567891
`
`0
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`
`Netflix, Inc. - Ex. 1031, Page 000007
`
`

`

`Transcript of David Rosenblum, Ph.D.
`February 7, 2023
`25
`
`1234567891
`
`0
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`
` Q Are you aware of whether the District
`Court construed any claims of the '419 patent?
` A I am not aware of that, no.
` My memory of the claim construction
`arguments was only arguments around whether the
`term procedure should be given its plain and
`ordinary meaning or if there was a construction
`around that term.
` Q How did you choose which exhibits from
`this IPR to consider?
` A I guess, you know, to a rough
`approximation the choice of exhibits was largely
`determined by the petition and Dr. Jagadish's
`declaration.
` Q I am done with the materials considered.
`I will switch to a different topic.
` A Okay.
` Q Have you heard of the term person of
`ordinary skill in the art?
` A Yes, I have.
` Q What is your understanding of what a
`person of ordinary skill in the art is generally
`
`7 (25 to 28)
`
`27
`
` A I consider myself to be a person of
`extraordinary skill in the art because I have
`research experience, I have a Ph.D., I have a
`level of knowledge, education, and experience well
`beyond that of a POSITA.
` Q Is it your opinion that a POSITA would
`have had a Bachelor's degree in electronic
`engineering, computer science, or a similar
`discipline with one or two years of experience in
`this or a related field?
` A Yes, that's the way I would characterize a
`POSITA, yes.
` Q What field would you consider to be
`related to those recited fields?
` A Well, those fields are very broad. I
`mean, for example, computer science is a very
`broad discipline that includes distributed system,
`software engineering, artificial intelligence,
`databases, a variety of subfields.
` Q If you could turn to Paragraph 24 of your
`declaration, I believe it is on Page 7.
` A Okay.
`
`26
`
`not specific to this matter?
` A I cover that term in my declaration.
`Essentially a person of ordinary skill in the art
`would be someone who has a Bachelor's degree in a
`relevant area such as computer science plus some
`number of years of experience or a Master's degree
`in the area.
` Q Is it your understanding that the person
`of ordinary skill in the art concept it surmises a
`hypothetical person practicing in the field of the
`invention at the time of the alleged invention?
` A Yes, I understand that.
` Q If I use the term POSITA would you
`understand me to refer to a person of ordinary
`skill in the art?
` A Yes, I would.
` Q Do you understand in this matter the
`relevant date is July 2, 2009 for determining the
`knowledge and experience of a POSITA?
` A Yes, I do.
` Q And do you believe you were a person of
`ordinary skill in the art in July of 2009?
`
` You said Paragraph 24, right?
` Q Yes.
` A I am there.
` Q Do you see how the end of that first
`sentence it says "or a similar discipline"?
` A Yes.
` Q Are there any particular disciplines you
`consider to be similar to the recited disciplines?
` A Computer engineering perhaps could be an
`example. I could imagine some people with a
`0
`degree in information technology or informatics.
`11
`In some universities or some parts of the world
`12
`you find other terms used for these fields.
`13
` Q Can you describe for me some of the things
`14
`that a person of ordinary skill in the art would
`15
`have known with respect to distributed computing
`16
`in 2009?
`17
` A They would have understood the basic
`18
`concepts of computer networks.
`19
` They would have understood the basic
`20
`concepts about how a computer system is organized.
`21
` They would have understood things related
`22
`PLANET DEPOS
`888.433.3767 | WWW.PLANETDEPOS.COM
`
`28
`
`1234567891
`
`1234567891
`
`0
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`
`1234567891
`
`0
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`
`Netflix, Inc. - Ex. 1031, Page 000008
`
`

`

`Transcript of David Rosenblum, Ph.D.
`February 7, 2023
`29
`
`8 (29 to 32)
`
`31
`World Wide Web. Users would access the World Wide
`Web through web browsers, they would have access
`to not just to simple information that could be
`displayed in the form of web pages, but many kinds
`of computations that could be performed behind the
`scenes, if you will, in some manner related to the
`information that's displayed on web pages. That's
`just one example.
` Q Are computing clusters another example of
`a distributed computing system that was in use in
`2009?
` A Yes, yes, I believe so.
` Q What are some of the ways that a user
`could cluster computing system could obtain
`results from calculations performed by a cluster?
` A With a cluster computing system quite
`often the kinds of applications one would run on
`such a system would be scientific computations,
`high performance computations, computations
`requiring a high degree of parallelism, and a lot
`of number crunching as it is often called.
` Q How would such a system produce results
`
`1234567891
`
`0
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`
`to storage, persistent storage of data.
` They would have probably had a basic
`understanding -- at least a basic understanding of
`databases.
` They would have had an understanding of
`contemporary programming languages of the time,
`possibly C, C++, Java, and some of the concepts
`around deploying programs in distributed systems,
`programs that were written in those languages.
` They would have known about some of the
`prevalent operating systems at the time, probably
`windows, possibly some variant of Unix such as
`Linux.
` Q What would a POSITA have understood the
`reason or utility of using a distributed computing
`system would be?
` A There are several reasons, several points
`of usefulness that arise in the use of a
`distributed system, the access to resources that
`are distributed remotely, and those resources
`could be storage resources, they could be
`computational resources.
`
`1234567891
`
`30
`
`that could be used by the user?
` They would understand the utility around
` A It depends on the particular application.
`the efficiency gains that could be realized in
`The application could produce numerical results in
`using a distributed system because having a
`some kind of textual form. They could produce
`distributed system with multiple processors spread
`renderings of some kind of visual object like a
`around the system allows for the possibility of
`weather map. For example, if you had a particular
`executing multiple computational tasks in parallel
`application that was doing a lot of number
`rather than requiring that collection of tasks to
`crunching for weather forecasting, well, the
`be executed sequentially.
`results of that computation might be rendered in
` Q Is the user of a distributed computing
`the form of objects that would be recognizable by
`0
`system seeking to obtain some sort of result from
`a meteorologist on a weather app.
`11
`the calculations performed by the system?
` Q So the cluster computer system would
`12
` MR. YOUNG: Objection, form.
`produce these things in the forms of files or some
`13
` THE WITNESS: I'd say in a very general
`format?
`14
`sense a user of any system is expecting to obtain
` A Again, it all depends on the particular
`15
`results from something that the system is able to
`application. It could be files, it could be
`16
`perform for them.
`displays on a computer screen, textual displays,
`17
`BY MR. PONDER:
`graphical displays on a computer screen. It could
`18
` Q And what were some of the ways that
`be things that are stored in a file system and
`19
`somebody could obtain results from a distributed
`then be made available for that display at a later
`20
`computing system in 2009?
`time.
`21
` A In 2009 probably the most obvious and most
` Q Let's assume that the cluster system
`22
`well-known example of a distributed system was the
`PLANET DEPOS
`888.433.3767 | WWW.PLANETDEPOS.COM
`
`32
`
`1234567891
`
`0
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`
`1234567891
`
`0
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`
`Netflix, Inc. - Ex. 1031, Page 000009
`
`

`

`Transcript of David Rosenblum, Ph.D.
`February 7, 2023
`33
`
`1234567891
`
`0
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`
`doesn't have a graphical user interface or provide
`any kind of visual or textual displays. What are
`some of the ways such a system could produce
`results to the user?
` A I guess I have a little trouble with the
`premise or the assumption underlying your
`question.
` In 2009 anybody interacting with most
`computer systems would have some kind of
`interactive device that they would use to provide
`both the inputs or the request to the system and
`then also to receive results.
` So if we were to assume hypothetically
`that a user could provide inputs or requests to
`the system but not directly receive results
`through that same interface then at first blush
`the only way I can imagine of preserving the
`results would be to put them in some kind of
`storage facility, a file system, you know,
`distributed file store, distributed -- storage
`area network, some kind of technology like that.
` Q Would an example of one of those types of
`
`9 (33 to 36)
`
`35
`
`sort of return value?
` A So a POSITA would understand a return
`value as being something that's returned by a
`function or a procedure inside of a program. It's
`possible that a return value from a function or
`procedure could eventually find its way back to
`the end user who initiated the application.
` Q Was it common for users of distributed
`computing systems to obtain the results from a
`computing cluster by storing the results in an
`interim -- in some sort of distributed storage
`system?
` MR. YOUNG: Objection, form.
` THE WITNESS: I think that was certainly
`one of the ways that could have -- that could have
`commonly been used to preserve results from a
`computation in a cluster system.
`BY MR. PONDER:
` Q And is one example that, say, a database?
` A Yes.
` A database is an example of a storage
`system that could be used to store results of a
`
`36
`
`computation.
`technologies be putting results in some sort of
` Q Looking at Paragraph 25 of your
`log file?
` A It could possibly be, I suppose. Again,
`declaration.
` A Okay.
`it would depend on the application.
` When I think of a log file and in many
` Q Do you see that you state in